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Supervox
22-03-08, 09:41 AM
Ok - well seeing as I asked & Fizz kindly agreed to make this a 'sticky' thread (on the proviso that it gets used regularly) I have the following suggestions :-
(a) This thread be for POSITIVE comments only - if you don't like F1 please don't litter up the thread with negative remarks.
(b) If anyone wishes to post remarks about a race within 24 hrs of that race then 'SPOILER' should be put at the top of the post - this will help prevent people finding results etc before they may have had chance to watch it - not everyone can watch them all live.
Ok, so to kick things off I'll ask which teams & drivers have your support this season ?
For me I'll have to admit to being a Lewis Hamilton fan - mainly because we haven't had a really top-grade British driver in a decent car for a number of years. However, others who I'd like to see do well this year are Heikki Kovalainen & Nico Rosberg becasue I think, along with LH they are the future of F1 & really have the ability & equipment to shake things up.
BTW - I'll also have to admit here that I LOATHE Ferrari !! (almost as much as I do Ducati !!) I have nothing against the drivers - just the attitude of the team & the way that the rules appear to have been bent to suit them so many times over the last 10 years or so.
** SPOILER SPACE **
Anyone watch today's qualifying ??
NOT a good day for Lewis - I just hope that his race pace, set-up & strategy makes up for it !!
glsuk1970
22-03-08, 09:52 AM
Good idea, there's a few people on here that are big F1 fans, myself included.
I'm a big Lewis fan too. Nice to have a British driver in a top team with a realistic chance of winning races and hopefully a championship or 7.
Spoiler ***
Not too good from Hamilton today though but then us Lewis fans would only be happy with pole or at least being ahead of the Ferraris. If he's carrying a few extra litres of fuel though he's still in with a good chance of a podium. Those Ferrari's did looked mightily fast, though
Should be a good race!
fizzwheel
22-03-08, 10:47 AM
Ferrari seem to have the qualiying setup licked. Heiki was quick to. Wander how Lewis will deal with having a quick team mate again, will it be mind games Alonso stylee ?
Setup problems with his car today me thinks, or they were concentrating on race pace maybe ?
Rain is forecast for some point tomorrow could be chaos !!!
I have to say I really enjoyed the austrailian Gp it so nice to see the cars moving around and sliding, and to hear an unrestrained by Traction Control engine note again.
As for Support
Well it'd be nice to see Roseberg building on his good start to the season and also BMW stepping up to. it be nice to see a 4 team battle for the top places rather than the usual ferrari vs Mclaren squabble.
Will Honda sort their car out will Button deliver on his promise, will the Adrian Newey designed Red Bull come good ?
Supervox
22-03-08, 11:56 AM
I don't forsee any mind games between LH & HK - unless they come from LH's dad - they seem to genuinely get along well - & I believe it will be good for McLaren to have 2 drivers pushing each other. it could also come down to RD's well documented history of favouring one driver - not with eqpt or personnel but just his own attitude - think back to DC & MH for examples.
You may consider me a bit sick & twisted here - but I have to admit that I'm really looking forward to a wet race - just to see how these guys handle 750 bhp without traction control !!
It appears that both Nick Heidfeld & Fernando Alonso have both lodged complaint regarding LH & HK - apprently they felt that they were held up by the McLaren pair on their final flying lap (LH & HK were on their slow down fuel saving lap after the chequred flag). So, we could see a change in the grid if they get a 5 place penalty.
I wonder if it has anything to do with the McLaren complaint about Renault cheating last year or trying to get BMW excluded due to fuel irrgularities ?
The politics begin again :-(
Supervox
22-03-08, 01:20 PM
** SPOILER **
Now confirmed - Lewis & Heikki both demoted 5 places on the grid becasue of the incident mentioned above.
glsuk1970
22-03-08, 02:19 PM
I hope it rains tomorrow, too. That'll really sort the men from the boys. Twas always great watching the likes of Senna and Alesi in the wet and we'll hopefully get the same sort of demonstration of car control if it pours down tomorrow - when it rains in Malasia, boy does it rain! It might even give the likes of Button and DC the chance for a point or two.
Seeing the repeated replays of Heidfeld passing the 2 McLarens, it did look mighty dangerous although there's no legislation saying that a minimum pace must be maintained after a driver has finished his qualifying run.. not yet, anyway. 5 places won't be too much of a penalty if the Heavens open, anything can happen when the safety car makes an appearance.
Anyone brave enough to make a prediction for the result?
I'm going for dry race:
1. Raikkonen
2. Massa
3. Hamilton
Wet race:
1. Hamilton (wishful thinking I know, but I don't think the oversteer problem he had in qualifying will be such a problem)
2. Raikkonen
3. Alonso
Sideshow#36
22-03-08, 04:09 PM
I used to be a massive F1 fan but then went off it. It seemed to go stale, but as you posted in your first item about positive comments only, I must say it seems to have improved a little this year. Taking away half of the driver aids etc seems to have really improved it. It also help having a competetive brit too. I really enjoyed last weeks! It will be even better when it moves across to the Beeb... no advert breaks! WooHoo.
fizzwheel
22-03-08, 08:04 PM
So if it rains, will they spin up as much as this...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7Jm4jNUjzs
Listen to it, sounds fricken awesome, I loved the Turbo era.
And another one, Cosworth V8 this time
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xDMvKHoAyU&feature=related
chakraist
23-03-08, 12:44 AM
Yeah, the turbo era with with over 1000bhp was amazing. Crazy cars. How they ever finished a race I will not know. Regardless, I'd love to see a wet race tomorrow.
Supervox
23-03-08, 10:37 AM
** SPOILER - RACE **
Well, NOT a particularly good day for LH :-(
Apart from the wheel fiasco - one of those things that happens I'm afraid - whoever made the final decision as to tyre selection (LH or Engineer ??) was wrong !! It was obvious from the lap times in his final stint that the 'Prime' tyre was the right choice for this race.
HK drove a solid race - nice to see him get his first podium for McLaren
KR did what LH did last time out - put in a faultless performance - I'd include in that his decision NOT to go for the inside line at the first corner !! I kind of wish he had though because that would have probably put both Ferrari's out on the first lap !! :p
FM - hmmm, driver error or mechanical fault ??
Quite a boring race really - some good battles mid-pack, but mostly dealt with by pit-stops instead of on the track where they should be :-(
I know we're only 2 races into the season, but it's a nice change to see it close at the top of the table AND to see a new name (and team) there as well - Nick Heidfeld BMW - Kubica isn't far adrift either.
All in all I'd say it's shaping up to be a good season - no single team seems to have a runaway advantage & plenty of drivers wanting to make their mark :D
DoubleD
23-03-08, 11:32 AM
I've not watched F1 for a while now as it was always the same, but since reading this thread I thought I would give it a watch this morning. I didn't know that they now all have the same ECU and no traction control, should be a bit more about driver skill now.
Looking forward to watching a few more races.
fizzwheel
23-03-08, 07:42 PM
All in all I'd say it's shaping up to be a good season - no single team seems to have a runaway advantage & plenty of drivers wanting to make their mark :D
Agreed
Not as action packed as last week, but still watchable. Bit of a schoolboy error by Massa I thought, just sounded like he'd given it to much throttle and round she went.
I really wish James Allen would shut up sometimes, he's starting to sound like he thinks LH can do no wrong. He messed up this weekend, like you say awful tyre choice.
Last week was racing, this week was more of a procession with pit stops. Hope this week was a fluke.
I really wish James Allen would shut up sometimes, he's starting to sound like he thinks LH can do no wrong.
So do I. He is really getting on my nerves. It doesn't help that he reminds me of someone I don't like but have to talk to on a regular basis. He's irritating and ruins the viewing having to listen to his drivel. Give the job to Brundle. Better still, give the sport back to BBC.
What? BBC have it back next year? Excellent stuff. Hope they don't bring the commentator as well as the sport.
I watched F1 since before I went to school. I have watched it every single year. I'm a Jenson fan. I truly believe that had Williams put him in the seat instead of Montoya he would have already been champion. He made a very shrewed move when getting out of the Williams seat when they wanted him back. It looks like Honda are finding their way back on the right path. With the guidance they now have, I seriously believe Jenson and Rubens will be more competitive as the season develops.
The banning of traction control and engine development last year was a good call. It has made the field a lot closer. OK, still no head to head racing like days of old, but a mistake by a driver now is punished hard. As shown by both Ferrari drivers in both races so far. The pack are closer on the heals of the top teams, so long as they don't make any mistakes, they are in a position to capitalize on the mistakes of teams and drivers in front of them.
I still say bring back turbo's and slick tyres. Give them back the 1000+bhp and let the drivers earn their zillion dollar wages. :wink: I could go on for ever, but I had better stop. Yes, I'm a petrol head. Love F1, love this thread. :lol:
glsuk1970
24-03-08, 07:43 AM
I still say bring back turbo's and slick tyres.
Well you might get half your wish come true next year as it looks like slick tyres are being re-introduced for 2009! No chance of turbos though :(
It should shape up to be a cracking season and with all the other rule changes (no spare car allowed, gearboxes must last 4 races etc) I think we're going to see a quite few more retirements because of reliability and driver error... can't wait for a wet race:evil: Add that 2 new circuits - one of those being a night race - BMW making good progress, Ross Brawn slowly working his magic at Honda and some bloody good younger drivers in the pack, we should see a change from last year with only 2 teams fighting for the top step.
I've watched F1 since about 1986 (used to video every highlights show - think they're still in my loft!) but my enthusiasm wained during the late 90's when Schumacher was dominant and a young family was more important at the weekends. Things have chance now though, kids are much older and MS has retired and we have a top class British driver to support in a top class British (ok, so RD only owns 15% but that surely enough to call it British, right?) team.
Should be a good year with a few more to follow.
+1 on the ITV coverage relating to Lewis. Alright, he's the man of the moment for a lot of the UK F1 fans (myself included) but there are another 21 drivers on the grid that most of us would like to hear about. Did you notice at the post race press conference we heard from Kimi Raikonnen and Robert Kubica but when it was Heikki Kovalainen's turn to speak about his debut podium for McLaren, they cut straight back to Mark Blundell and Steve Ryder! WTF!! Would they have done that if Hamilton was 3rd? I think not
Which leads me nicey onto another point. Steve Ryder. Why?
I hope BBC do a better job of employing presenters who are actually passionate about the sport and not just blagging a paid for around the world holiday.
Anyway, I love Formula 1 and I'm glad it in good shape again.
Supervox
24-03-08, 08:03 AM
I didn't know that slicks were on their way back <hangs head in shame> that really IS good news !!
As for Steve Rider I take your point - but as F1 is always going to be one of the 'Flagship Presentations' (doesn't matter who has the rights) I think that a well known face will be chosen to 'front' the programme - I don't have a problem with this as long as they also use others who know the sport. As I've said before I really believe that Murray Walker needs to be involved in some way - though probably not as main commentator - I don't care what the Beeb have to do to achieve this - get an Act passed by Parliament if that's what it takes !!
As for LH - I agree the coverage is a bit much at times - from James Allen in particular (hopefully he'll NOT be picked up by the BBC) - but, in some ways it's understandable - he's the first British driver in a long time to actually be at the sharp end of the racing & other countries presentations are equally as 'biased' - try looking at the Spanish press for example !!
What has really surprised me so far is why people are surprised by the pace of Red Bull's car this year (ok it looks to be a little on the fragile side) Adrian Newey does not design bad cars - just look at his CV for God's sake !! The man is a true genius !!
Just one final thing I picked up on at the weekend - apparently, due to the new rules regarding aerodynamics next season all of the ugly apendages (micro wings that seem to be all over the cars in various places) are to be banned - so, we may see some really good looking cars again. :cool:
glsuk1970
24-03-08, 08:40 AM
There's a host of other changes being introduced for 2009 including Kinetic Energy Recovery System or KERS. This is going to make racing interesting next year - KERS stores up energy used when braking and can be-reused to give the car a boost at the push of a button - kind of like a turbo but with a finite amount of energy. F1 engineers will be forced to develop this technology to become competitive but eventually the technology will end up on cars that Joe Public buy - it's F1's contribution to making motoring greener.
Most teams have just tweaked their '07 cars for this season as the '09 cars require a lot of development time. Track time for testing is limited to 30,000 Km per seaon so many teams have already been testing ideas their '09 cars over the winter, including running on slick tyres (2.5 seconds per lap quicker according to Button, with '07 levels of downforce).
Tyre warmer will also be banned in 2009 - that's going to be hilarious/dangerous. Here's a quote from Heidfield taken from F1 racing:
"To be honest (running without tyre warners) it was a bit of a joke. The tyres took ages to get up to temperature and my first flying lap was 14 seconds off the pace. It was like having F1 power with Formula Ford levels of downforce."
Rather him than me.
I've heard about the slicks but yet to see any concrete statement to say it is coming back in. As for the lack of tyre warmers. I heard this too. Something to do with allowing the teams at the back of the grid to get a good start with everyone on effectively, the same even playing field of performance.
If it happens, and I'd be gobsmacked if it does, we have the perfect recipe for a total first corner disaster.
There was no engine development at all in 2007/8. At the end of the 2006 season all teams had to submit their latest developed engine to the FIA. This was the engine they were committed to for the next two years. Another method of trying to get the lower teams more competitive. Last year there wasn't much difference, but this year it is easier to see, the lower teams have better packages. Of course the banning of traction control has had a big effect on this.
I'm sure the American 'champ cars' have had this 'KERS' system for quite some years. It's not new technology. They call it something like the 'power to pass button'.
Supervox
24-03-08, 09:32 PM
I'm sure the American 'champ cars' have had this 'KERS' system for quite some years. It's not new technology. They call it something like the 'power to pass button'.
Is that what they use in A1 cars ? They also have a 'boost' button that they can use 5 (?) times during a race - once activated it remains 'live' until they release the throttle pedal I think.
Is that what they use in A1 cars ? They also have a 'boost' button that they can use 5 (?) times during a race - once activated it remains 'live' until they release the throttle pedal I think.
Same difference I believe.
glsuk1970
25-03-08, 10:44 AM
Well, you learn something new everday! The way it's been portrayed in the F1 arena is that it's new technology or maybe I just assumed it was, philistine that I am. Can't say I watch any American motorsport (not since Mansell left Indy car racing, at least) so I'm not up to speed on the car specs.
You're right BigApe about nothing concrete being released by the FIA concerning the banning of tyre warmers and the re-introduction if slicks, if running on cold tyres with lower downforce is that dangerous then it does seem a step too far.
This is why I love F1 - it's not just the race on Sunday, it's all the bull**** and politics that comes with it!
plowsie
25-03-08, 10:50 AM
I tip Nelson Piquet to win a race this season, looked a promising driver the past few years. Rather pleased with Kubica :) Tough one to call the championship winner this season though me thinks.
Another thing...I am really happy that they have ditched traction control...brings a bit more fun back into the racing...Maybe this will happen in the Moto GP soon :D
fizzwheel
25-03-08, 05:10 PM
So petulant whinging or just being honest..
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7312280.stm
Oh and is anybody in the Profantasyf1 fantasy formula one league. I've got a team in ?
Supervox
25-03-08, 06:49 PM
So petulant whinging or just being honest..
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7312280.stm
Oh and is anybody in the Profantasyf1 fantasy formula one league. I've got a team in ?
Spoiled brat !!
glsuk1970
25-03-08, 09:48 PM
Brilliant. 2nd race of the season barely finished and already he's publicly discussing his potential 2009 prospects away from Renault. Not what you'd call a motivational interview if you're part of the Renault team :rolleyes:
I wonder if Flavio Briatore will bite his lip when Alonso doesn't get the results he feels he deserves and starts washing his dirty laundry in public again. They were all lovely dovey when things were going well in '05 and '06 but this year will really test their relationship... :smt055 or :smt076
Shame really cause he's obviously a gifted driver, on par with Raikonnen in terms of natural ability, but doesn't he moan???
He does moan. But he is a superb driver. He'll not sit at Renault and bide his time for his next move. He'll still put all the effort in required. He just doesn't seem to understand team loyalty. For team loyalty we should be looking at Jenson Button and his dogged determination to stick with Honda regardless of last years season. Weather he is contracted to them for this year or not. Next year or not. Not as it currently stands. He has never dissed the team and has always been a superb team player.
Did I mention I am a JB fan. :lol: I think in April when they get the new modifications (which is a couple of months earlier than some of the other teams are going to be introducing theirs) I think Honda will be stepping up another notch and we will see Jenson and Rubens fighting for points consistently.
Supervox
25-03-08, 10:27 PM
As far as Alonso goes - you can just about guarantee that if their was even the slightest hint of an agreement between him & Ferrari neither side would be saying a word !!
Si, I also like JB - but you have to admit his decisions have left a bit to be desired, haven't they ?!!
According to the runour mill it cost him somewhere around 5 million to buy his way out of the Williams contract so he could remain at Honda - I wonder if he feels it was really money well spent ?
The worst of it is I think that Ross Brawn will really help turn things around - this actually causes me a problem 'cos on one hand I admire the guy as a tactical genius, but on the other I consider him one of the 2 biggest cheats in F1 history - however I digress, as I was saying although I believe he'll turn things around I don't think that Jenson will benefit from it - by the time he's worked his magic JB will past his peak & probably on his way back 'down' into the lesser teams where he'll be valued for his experience but with no real chance of a WDC :(
As far as Alonso goes - you can just about guarantee that if their was even the slightest hint of an agreement between him & Ferrari neither side would be saying a word !!
Si, I also like JB - but you have to admit his decisions have left a bit to be desired, haven't they ?!!
According to the runour mill it cost him somewhere around 5 million to buy his way out of the Williams contract so he could remain at Honda - I wonder if he feels it was really money well spent ?
The worst of it is I think that Ross Brawn will really help turn things around - this actually causes me a problem 'cos on one hand I admire the guy as a tactical genius, but on the other I consider him one of the 2 biggest cheats in F1 history - however I digress, as I was saying although I believe he'll turn things around I don't think that Jenson will benefit from it - by the time he's worked his magic JB will past his peak & probably on his way back 'down' into the lesser teams where he'll be valued for his experience but with no real chance of a WDC :(
Like David Coulthard you mean:?: Possibly but I don't think so. Ross Brawn is not the boss at Honda. Honda really do think that JB can be world champion for them. The guy has plenty of years left in him and I don't think it's going to long before Honda are back where they were going when they were BAR.
As for JB making the wrong move. I don't think he did. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. When he made that decision, Williams were already on the way down. They had lost BMW as an engine supplier and were buying customer engines. Also at the same time, Honda were going in the right direction. Up. Then they had the awful year last year. No one would have predicted that. They fully expected to be contesting for the title last year. It was nothing other than a complete disaster. But like I said, hindsight is a wonderful thing. Had Williams taken on JB instead of Montoya, when they still had a competitive car, I think he could have been world champion already.
That would have been the dream team for me. Having been a Williams fan from a very early age. To see JB win in a Williams would have been just perfect. I was seriously disappointed when Williams let him go and employed Montoya. Williams have been on the grid for a billion years and the only surviving independent racing team out there. It took Frank Williams years and years before he even won his first race. He was the joke of the pack. He turned it all around though.
I've also had the honour of working at the HQ. I've had access to every area in the whole of the complex. I've watched them build cars for up coming races. Watched them practise the pitstops. Watch them fabricate parts out of carbon fibre. I've been in the development offices, where they design the latest parts. And I've been in the old and the brand new museums. I've sat in the very same cars that have won races. Senna's and Mansell's. I've held in my hands the trophies for races won. I think I've been quite privileged really.
I even thought about applying for a position as a fibre optics engineer. I used to do this as a career. They had a position open. I just don't think Jo would have been to chuffed me disappearing for most of the year. :sad:
fizzwheel
26-03-08, 08:28 AM
I've also had the honour of working at the HQ. I've had access to every area in the whole of the complex. I've watched them build cars for up coming races. Watched them practise the pitstops. Watch them fabricate parts out of carbon fibre. I've been in the development offices, where they design the latest parts. And I've been in the old and the brand new museums. I've sat in the very same cars that have won races. Senna's and Mansell's. I've held in my hands the trophies for races won. I think I've been quite privileged really.
I even thought about applying for a position as a fibre optics engineer. I used to do this as a career. They had a position open. I just don't think Jo would have been to chuffed me disappearing for most of the year. :sad:
To right, wow I'm not jealous, no, not at all, not even a tiny weeny bit
NOT !!
I nearly applied for a Job at Mclaren a few years ago, they wanted a I.T. guy for their test team, I ticked every box on the advert except for one and unfortunately it was a major one and I didnt want to blag it !!
As for Button, well I think if he's not careful he is destined to be the next DC. They were talking the other week about him signed for Honda for another 2 or 3 years. I know he is loyal but he needs IMHO to look around and see what else is available, I cant see them turning that car around quickly. I'd be looking to get out if it were me.
Winning one race, does not a champion make IMHO.
DanDare
26-03-08, 03:14 PM
As for Button, well I think if he's not careful he is destined to be the next DC. They were talking the other week about him signed for Honda for another 2 or 3 years. I know he is loyal but he needs IMHO to look around and see what else is available, I cant see them turning that car around quickly. I'd be looking to get out if it were me.
That's true but if you were in a strugling team and Ross Brawn came along and offered his input, you'd be pretty excited. Look how he and Todt brought forward Ferrari's development from a rubbish car to a winning car.
I miss the good ol days with slicks, V10's, no driver aids, and one qualifying session.
fizzwheel
26-03-08, 03:50 PM
That's true but if you were in a strugling team and Ross Brawn came along and offered his input, you'd be pretty excited. Look how he and Todt brought forward Ferrari's development from a rubbish car to a winning car.
True, but I wander how successful they would have been without Schumacher to work with. I dont think the turn round at Ferrari was purely down to RB or JT, it had a lot to do with MS as well ( Supervox will now shoot me :D )
I miss the good ol days with slicks, V10's, no driver aids, and one qualifying session.
Nah turbo's with no fuel or boost restrictions were much better ;)
glsuk1970
28-03-08, 04:02 PM
To right, wow I'm not jealous, no, not at all, not even a tiny weeny bit
NOT !!
Me neither!! :---)
As for Button, well I think if he's not careful he is destined to be the next DC. They were talking the other week about him signed for Honda for another 2 or 3 years. I know he is loyal but he needs IMHO to look around and see what else is available, I cant see them turning that car around quickly. I'd be looking to get out if it were me.
Winning one race, does not a champion make IMHO.
I suspect that Button has his fingers tightly crossed that Ross Brawn can make enough difference in the team for this season to avoid a repeat of 2007 but he's probably also hoping that next years car will be more towards the front of the grid, what with the introduction of new car design regulations having the potential to level the playing field.
Brawn has gone on record recently saying that this years car design is an interim design and largely, only developments that will help the '09 car will be introduced to this years model.
I hope Honda reward his patience and eventually give him a competitive car
(not too competitive, mind - don't want him being quicker than the McLarens ;)). He's been an absolute professional despite some appalling qualifying and race performances (not because of anything he's done, mind) and his talent and loyalty deserves nothing less.
fizzwheel
05-04-08, 10:00 PM
So can Kubica turn his poll into a win tomorrow, will Massa stay on the track, what will hamilton do from a 2nd row start... is Kimi the dark horse...
Supervox
06-04-08, 09:26 AM
I don't think that the BMW will have the 'race pace' to match the Ferraris (unfortunately) - I genuinely believe it will be wonderful when we have 3 (maybe even 4, 5 or 6 if Williams, Renault & Honda can get their acts together) teams genuinely fighting for the championship - along with possibly 12 drivers !!
I'd also be very interested (along with the entire pitlane) to know the fuel situation - especially regarding KR, LH & FM.
I don't tend to make predictions - there are too many variables to make it anything other than a guess - but, I think RK will get off the line well (assuming he has a very light fuel load) and that FM & LH will have some sort of 'ding-dong' at the first corner with LH coming out ahead in 2nd place - possibly allowing KR to overtake FM as well into 3rd.
As for the final result - well, we'll have to see !! :D
chakraist
06-04-08, 11:37 AM
Spoiler
****.
glsuk1970
06-04-08, 01:57 PM
Two words. Alonso. Dirty.
I'm sulking now :smt022so I'm not going to post anything about the race until I've cheered up
Having said that I would like to mention that I think Alonso is a **** (rhymes with hat).
That is all. For now.
Supervox
08-04-08, 11:39 AM
So much for my prediction then !!!
But, then again I did say that there are too many variables to be certain - such as a driver not hitting the anti-stall button, or a driver not accelerating quite as hard as he might in order to draw another car into the back of him !! :p
I guess the only remotely reasonable thing about the result (from a LH fan's point of view) is that the 10 points went to Massa & not Raikkonen.
O well, it's still very early in the season - & it is gonna be fun watching 3, 4 or even 5 drivers in the hunt for the Championship !! :D
fizzwheel
08-04-08, 01:19 PM
or a driver not accelerating quite as hard as he might in order to draw another car into the back of him !! :p
Oh controversial !!!
From what I've read, it appears that Mclaren think that LH front wing broke before he hit the back of FA. When the wing broke, downforce lost, drag reduced so that car unexpectedly sped up. Coupled with the fact that FA looked to me like he was struggling with traction and that LH got a better drive off the corner meant contact.
Renault released telemetry that showed that FA had his foot flat down on the floor when LH hit the back of him...
chakraist
08-04-08, 08:24 PM
Regardless, Alonso is still dirty.
Supervox
09-04-08, 07:10 AM
Oh controversial !!!
From what I've read, it appears that Mclaren think that LH front wing broke before he hit the back of FA. When the wing broke, downforce lost, drag reduced so that car unexpectedly sped up. Coupled with the fact that FA looked to me like he was struggling with traction and that LH got a better drive off the corner meant contact.
Renault released telemetry that showed that FA had his foot flat down on the floor when LH hit the back of him...
Whilst I pretty much agree with you - and I'll admit I was hoping to get a bite from someone over the comment - I'll never accept team produced telemetry as 'evidence' unless it's seen at the moment of the event.
thedonal
09-04-08, 05:55 PM
So much for my prediction then !!!
O well, it's still very early in the season - & it is gonna be fun watching 3, 4 or even 5 drivers in the hunt for the Championship !! :D
In all fairness, despite the slowish start that let Massa (spit, spit...!) get past him, he did keep pace with the Fiats for the duration of the race- he's a great driver and the BMW's pace is far better this year. He's also making Heidfeld- himself a very skilled driver- look positively shabby this year!
Go Kubica! (you can see where my loyalty lies!)
I personally hope that Alonso get's Massa's seat soon- why Massa was given a contract until 2009, I don't know. He only wins when he's on pole- ie with a clear track in front of him, mainly due to a very fast car. His lack of skill for his status has been clear from the first 2 races of the season and from his past lack of ability in traffic.
It will be good to get F1 back on the beeb- agreed on ITV's over coverage of the Hamiltons (how does his dad get so much air-time? It strikes me as a bit of an odd setup overall).
Let's just hope the commentary is good, it's broadcast in 16:9 (not common for BBC) and there's none of that soapy nonsense with Lewis and Haikke passing time on a sofa pr exercises again.
And I'd really love to see Buttons fortunes improve again- he's a very likeable chap and his commitment and team manner is very respectable.
Anyone watch the qualifying? One thinks Alonso may be running a bit light! I don't think Lewis is that happy with the car at the moment. I watched GP2 this afternoon too, I wish F1 had the same level of action, they were coming off the track everywhere! :)
Supervox
26-04-08, 06:32 PM
I hope that the McLarens weren't running a light fuel load - if they were then they're screwed !!
Unfortunately, I think that the Ferrari's are gonna run away with this one - with possibly FA in the mix (home track and all that as 'inspiration').
I think the best that LH can wish for - assuming we have a straightforward race - is 3rd.
First time I've seen the 'Dumbo Ears' wings on the Honda - God they make the car look ugly !! Roll on next season when all added appendages will be banned.
glsuk1970
27-04-08, 07:33 AM
Should be a good race today with the top half of the grid so tightly packed together but there'll have been some head scratching in the McLaren camp last night... fifth and sixth?? Could they be missing the input of an experienced F1 driver when setting up the car, I wonder?
With Alonso on a light fuel load, he could quite easily be ahead into the first corner but I hope Raikkonen or even Kubica gets there first. Hamilton will be fired up for a good start after his effort 3 weeks ago and Webber is usually a quick starter too.
Not long to go now!
Flamin_Squirrel
27-04-08, 12:32 PM
What the... why have they fecked the track up? I do hate this insistence on ruining circuits by adding chicanes for 'safety' reasons.
Supervox
27-04-08, 03:52 PM
What the... why have they fecked the track up? I do hate this insistence on ruining circuits by adding chicanes for 'safety' reasons.
That was part of the Poison Dwarf's 'directive' - playing on the safety angle, but in reality just slowing the cars down at certain points so that the sponsors names could be seen thus turning the cars into slow moving mobile advertising hoardings !!!
Flamin_Squirrel
27-04-08, 05:04 PM
Well, he looks about 157, so fingers cross he'll simply expire soon.
thedonal
27-04-08, 06:28 PM
Was a dramatic race- I'm relieved to see Heikki get away relatively unscathed. A few offs today again and- oh look- more incidents around David Coultard. Surely the Lantern Jawed Win Dodger should be getting the message by now....
chakraist
27-04-08, 06:40 PM
David Coulthard's jaw is indeed very large... perhaps this is the reason he is involved in so many incidents?
Supervox
27-04-08, 08:42 PM
Heikki's accident was VERY scary !!
I can't believe (but am very pleased) that he escaped with a concussion & a bruised arm. :-D
Tim in Belgium
27-04-08, 08:50 PM
Dramatic as in the odd crash and people driving in to each other. Apart from that very little excitement and very little true overtaking.
At least it was raining outside and I had nothing else better to do. I used to love F1 as a kid, now I only watch it to pass the time. How long can it survive like this?
chakraist
27-04-08, 09:02 PM
09 should be good!
Slick tyres confirmed. Should make a difference. Hopefully.
fizzwheel
28-04-08, 12:05 PM
Slick tyres confirmed. Should make a difference. Hopefully.
I hope so to. Also they've banned all those little aero wings and bits and pieces, i.e. the dumbo wings on the front of the honda would be banned under next years regs so aero grip and the chance to recover aero grip is reduced as well.
And also maybe a little battery power :) Gonna start using "Kinetic Energy Recovery System" - i.e. store energy from braking into batteries and the drivers can use them like a boast.
And also maybe a little battery power :) Gonna start using "Kinetic Energy Recovery System" - i.e. store energy from braking into batteries and the drivers can use them like a boast.
Or even a boost. :lol:
Maybe we'll boast about there boost....
glsuk1970
06-05-08, 12:06 PM
Poor Super Aguri...
http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?id=42514
Sadly, this means Brit Anthony Davidson is out of a job. Shame that.
glsuk1970
09-05-08, 02:54 PM
Turkey then.
Massa's took pole and the win last year and the year before but can he beat an on-form Kimi or the improved McLarens? It was a Fiat 1-2 last year so fingers crossed that it doesn't happen again.
Seems like the Fiats are taking a while to get their rubber up to temperature so their early pace might not be so strong. The McLaren's are the opposite so they should be quick in qualifying tomorrow.
I'd be happy if Hamilton finishes ahead of Raikkonen when the chequered flag falls on Sunday.
fizzwheel
11-05-08, 01:10 PM
SHUT UP JAMES ALLEN YOU ANNOYING C*NT.
FFS 20 drivers in the race, you'd never guess would you, I thought there was only one.
I wander how many times he has said "Lewis Hamilton" during the course of this race.
Supervox
11-05-08, 04:38 PM
SHUT UP JAMES ALLEN YOU ANNOYING C*NT.
FFS 20 drivers in the race, you'd never guess would you, I thought there was only one.
I wander how many times he has said "Lewis Hamilton" during the course of this race.
+1
I'm as biased, xenophobic, patriotic (take your choice !!) as anyone - I'll always cheer a British driver - but JA just takes the p*ss !!
SHUT UP JAMES ALLEN YOU ANNOYING C*NT.
FFS 20 drivers in the race, you'd never guess would you, I thought there was only one.
I wander how many times he has said "Lewis Hamilton" during the course of this race.
For defo!!!
Yesterday, didn't he say something like "The equivalent of tying an adult labrador to your helmet"?
thedonal
23-05-08, 06:31 PM
The whole ITV thing of just about ONLY covering Hamilton is starting to get up my F1 crowd's collective behinds. Especially the way they 'run out of time' just after coverage of Lewis' post race conference, even if another driver's been missed. It's getting ridiculous. Though his dad's getting less airtime this year- poorly negotiated contract?!
Though fair play to Hamilton for a great overtake last race. He's clearly suffering from lack of experience (and Alonso's) this year. I think, next year could be a good year for Lewis- 2008 is clearly his big learning experience.
I just wish he'd accept responsibility (or team responsibility) for issues like the shameful 3 stopper last race- apparently Bridgestone's fault as they recommended it (which they obviously denied, and it's still up to McLaren to make the choice based on information given). It's been a while since he really said- "yeah, I messed up", rather than blaming other people's decisions.
Clearly also, Kovi is also getting less overall respect from Uncle Ron- another driver being treated as support for Hami. He's such a promising driver- I hope McLaren don't do him out of the opportunities to shine. Time will tell.
So, anyway. Monaco in the rain. Should be a fairly eventful race- just like the race last year (Germany I think), when loads of cars went floating off the road.
Anyway- as ever, GO KUBICA!!!
Supervox
23-05-08, 07:43 PM
. . . Though fair play to Hamilton for a great overtake last race.
+1
. . . He's clearly suffering from lack of experience (and Alonso's) this year. I think, next year could be a good year for Lewis- 2008 is clearly his big learning experience.
I think the only experience he's lacking is possibly in set-up & he seems to make up for that to a certain extent with talent.
. . . I just wish he'd accept responsibility (or team responsibility) for issues like the shameful 3 stopper last race- apparently Bridgestone's fault as they recommended it (which they obviously denied, and it's still up to McLaren to make the choice based on information given). It's been a while since he really said- "yeah, I messed up", rather than blaming other people's decisions.
Why "shameful" ? I think that whatever the reason behind it - him being harder on the tyres than others or just RD or even LH himself deciding to try a 'Scumacher', he drove a stunning race.
As for taking the blame I seem to remember his comments after a couple of races this season basically blaming himself for everything that went wrong !!
. . . Clearly also, Kovi is also getting less overall respect from Uncle Ron- another driver being treated as support for Hami. He's such a promising driver- I hope McLaren don't do him out of the opportunities to shine. Time will tell.
Regardless of the 'neutrality' of RD - & I do believe that he does not issue team orders until mathmatically impossible for 1 driver to win the championship - he has a history of spending more time / investing more in 1 driver than another. Think back to MH & DC - RD was forever spending time with Mikka that he didn't with David.
. . . So, anyway. Monaco in the rain. Should be a fairly eventful race- just like the race last year (Germany I think), when loads of cars went floating off the road.
Rain is definitely on the cards for the weekend - it will be worse if it stays away tomorrow & just 'appears' for the race.
But what a scenario :-
MONACO - RAIN - NO TRACTION CONTROL !!!
Anyway- as ever, GO KUBICA!!![/quote]
thedonal
23-05-08, 08:16 PM
OK- shameful is possibly a very strong word to use, but there's a couple of occasions where an extra stop has occurred that 'robbed' Hami of a 1st or very close, imo. I understand the caution of doing that extra stop, but he could have had it! I'm a Kubica and therefore BMW supporter, but would like to see Lewis do the do's. He has got great talent- I hope it's not a 1st season wonder....
He has been fairly humble and respectable on a lot of occasions, but there have been a few occasions where he hasn't seemed to be straight up about the race- more like he was saying what Uncle Ron wanted him to say- ie toeing the corporate line. It's a shame- he should be allowed to vent and be passionate (like Alonso!) about the race. He clearly is passionate about racing- his achievements so far are testament to that.
Being a fairly recent (2.5 seasons) spectator of F1, I can't comment on previous Dennis form, but he doesn't really get respect from me.
I would also like to see Jensen get a fair stab at the race too- ie a far better aero/reliability package from Honda. It was so disappointing, after his win last year and his clearly gained confidence/hunger, that he is fighting a bad car again. They are getting there, but I'd just like to see what he could do once he realises that he can do it.
Jensen's a talented driver, but is one of those that seems to need to achieve something, before he believes he can do it (if you understand what I mean). Not necessarily World Champion material, but capable of being up there.
Anyway- I'm rambling- had nearly a bottle of Faustino and I'm off for more!!!
fizzwheel
23-05-08, 08:19 PM
I would also like to see Jensen get a fair stab at the race too- ie a far better aero/reliability package from Honda.
He needs to get out of that Honda before he's going to do anything useful.
He needs to get into
Maclaren
Ferrari
BMW
Williams
Renault
Otherwise he aint going nowhere IMHO.
Supervox
23-05-08, 11:30 PM
. . . but there have been a few occasions where he hasn't seemed to be straight up about the race- more like he was saying what Uncle Ron wanted him to say- ie toeing the corporate line.
And this surprises you ??
Of course he's going to "toe the corporate line" - why on earth would he go against those that pay his salary ?
. . .It's a shame- he should be allowed to vent and be passionate (like Alonso!) about the race
And we all know what happened to FA when he did so !!
thedonal
24-05-08, 09:20 AM
Yeah but still.....! :D
He just seems more like he's been told what to say than other drivers.
I don't think Fernando has got off badly- he has more of a challenge being back in Renault, but I'm convinced he will still shine. And let's face it- he got out of a situation that he was very unhappy in and is far more settled in his old team again. I'm hoping he get's Massa's seat soon- Alonso and Raikkonen would make an unbeatable Fiat team.
I still laugh about Kimi's response when asked where he was while Schumi was getting his last race presentation- "I was having a sh!t"!!! Classic.
thedonal
24-05-08, 09:21 AM
Another question for ya- do you think Ross Brawn will actually make something of Honda over the next 1 and a half seasons?
Supervox
24-05-08, 11:54 AM
Another question for ya- do you think Ross Brawn will actually make something of Honda over the next 1 and a half seasons?
Yes - if Honda give him as much freedom as Ferrari did.
But let's not forget RB's real genius is as a strategist - not much point in having a brilliant mind working things out as the race progresses if the car is stuck mid-pack.
Does anyone else think Alonso could give Raikkonen a good hiding if they were in the same car etc???
fizzwheel
25-05-08, 11:12 AM
MONACO - RAIN - NO TRACTION CONTROL !!!
If it is wet and it looks like its going to be, its going to be an awesome spectacle or utter carnage !!
Oh and a nice bit of archive footage or "Mr Monaco" to what a character Graham Hill was :cool:
thedonal
25-05-08, 04:36 PM
What a race! No giveaways for those waiting for the replay, but it was certainly eventful!!
Potential race of the season.
Managed to avoid the pre-race Lewis Hamilton Show too, by being far more entertained by the NW200. Another case of what a race- but here is the wrong venue...
Does anyone else think Alonso could give Raikkonen a good hiding if they were in the same car etc???
Nah, not enough room for two in the same car ;)
It would be an interesting race with the two of em in identical cars though.
Supervox
25-05-08, 05:33 PM
SPOILER SPACE (for those who haven't seen the race yet !!)
Well, I think LH has certainly answered those critics who have said that he lacks 'maturity' !!
Ok, so he made a mistake early on - but then so did all the top drivers (some more than most eh KR ?? !!) but after that he drove a flawless race & thoroughly deserved the win.
Gutted for Sutil - 4th would have been an astounding result for Force India - I'll be generous & accept the pundits view that KR just braked in the wrong place - he made enough mistakes throughout the race to be considered for my 'Muppet of the Day' award - but in all honesty that really has to go (IMHO) to Alonso - is there anyone on the planet who thought that his move on Heidfeld at the the hairpin was going to work ???? !!!!
I think NP Jnr will be lucky to keep his seat st the end of the season he can't drive in the dry & he can't drive in the damp either - wonder if his old man still thinks that all of his behind the scenes 'manoeuvering' last season and in the off-season to get Jnr the drive is still worth it ??
Mistake by Kimi, yes, but that was some incredible car control to keep slowing it down whilst going lock-to-lock-to-lock faster than you can say "gravelly voiced Finn".
Great race I thought. Kept me interested. LH a deserved winner despite being a bit fortunate in the early stages, he was so much quicker than the rest for the middle period of the race. The cars looked spectacular too, and you could hear them spinning up the rears all the time, brilliant.
I think GB should have been able to overtake LE. I was disappointed when GN broke his gearbox and was surprised that HZ didn't call in FD to change to dry tyres. When RG went in to the pits and came out in front of GW, I bet TP was gutted. BV could have picked up a place when the pace car came out but he was told over the radio by EW to stay where he was.
It was good a race and a good result. I normally hate Monaco Grand Prix but the rain and lack of traction control did add some spice. Shame every race can't be in the wet, might see some overtaking other than in the pits then.
glsuk1970
28-05-08, 03:46 PM
I think GB should have been able to overtake LE. I was disappointed when GN broke his gearbox and was surprised that HZ didn't call in FD to change to dry tyres. When RG went in to the pits and came out in front of GW, I bet TP was gutted. BV could have picked up a place when the pace car came out but he was told over the radio by EW to stay where he was.
:smt046
Good race that, shame thay can't all be that unpredictable.
You've got to feel really, really sorry for Adrian Sutil though. Races like that happen once maybe twice a seaon and to be punted out from 4th place by a Fiat?? Gutted. Is that the first time Massa has not won from pole?
It's all shaping up to be a great season this year -a third of the way through and only 6 points covering 4 drivers from 3 teams. Be nice to see Kubica take a win soon just to keep everyone on their toes (with Hamilton second though, obviously).
Be nice to see Kubica take a win soon just to keep everyone on their toes (with Hamilton second though, obviously).
Does everyone really like Lewis Hamilton on here???? I hate the greasy tosser.
Supervox
28-05-08, 04:21 PM
Does everyone really like Lewis Hamilton on here???? I hate the greasy tosser.
Whilst you are of course free to like / dislike who you see fit - I'm interested in knowing what causes you to call him a "greasy tosser" ?
Why 'greasy' & why 'tosser' ?
Ok, tosser is a bit harsh. I simply used that to display my disliking of him. It really gets on my nerves how false he seems. Those classic trademark "I love everyone of you guys, i couldn't have done it without you. This wins for you. We're gonna party tonight? Yeah." conversations he has at the end of races.
I also feel a little sorry for him, in a way. As it appears he is very held back in what he should and shouldn't do. Especially by the sponsors. I am surprised Maclaren, the sponsors and the like let him get anywhere near that bimbo girl from the Monaco grid.
I think he is a good driver, but a bit of a banale person. He needs more of a character like Rossi, Lorenzo or even, dare i say it, Alonso have.
They're coached to death. Listening to an F1 driver talk to the press is like listening to a footballer. "Credit to the team" "At the end of the day", "just looking forward to next season", blah blah blah. It's rare they say anything sincere or interesting.
I find motorcycle racers are much more interesting. They're probably not much more characterful (with exceptions) but I just don't think they're coached as much.
Supervox
28-05-08, 07:39 PM
They're coached to death. Listening to an F1 driver talk to the press is like listening to a footballer. "Credit to the team" "At the end of the day", "just looking forward to next season", blah blah blah. It's rare they say anything sincere or interesting.
I find motorcycle racers are much more interesting. They're probably not much more characterful (with exceptions) but I just don't think they're coached as much.
I think you'll find motorcycle racers (at least the successful ones) say much the same as car racers - they all pay homage to the 'sponsorship dollar' to a certain extent.
Or on the rare occasion that someone like Biaggi comes along & starts spouting we've all seen what happens !! You end up going from team to team getting 'weaker' machinery all the time.
As for putting them in the same category as wussball players - well at least petrolheads can string a coherent sentence together !!
Edwards has managed to stay with top teams for a long time despite never winning a race and being very very outspoken. Of course they all know which side their bread is buttered, but I think generally bike racers speak more freely, it's just the perception I get.
Also, r.e your "wussball" statement (imaginative btw), I wasn't categorising anybody, but however comprehensible they are they do say the same sorts of things.
DanDare
03-06-08, 11:31 AM
I was losing the plot with watching F1, now Mosley stays on, I shall boycott it all together. :mad:
fizzwheel
03-06-08, 11:39 AM
Mosley stays, oh dear... thats not goig to work out well I think.
Supervox
03-06-08, 04:11 PM
We shall see what happens next - could be interesting, ADAC (the German Automobile Association) has already withdrawn from the FIA & the American Automobile Association are considering doing the same - how many other s may join them if they set up a 'breakaway' organisation ?
I reckon now he's won and managed to keep his job, he'll quit anyway. Maybe not straight away, but hopefully at the end of the season.
I don't know what all the fuss is about. So his mum and dad were fascists and he likes a bit of strict discipline. What's that got to do with running a car racing organisation?
I don't know what all the fuss is about. So his mum and dad were fascists and he likes a bit of strict discipline. What's that got to do with running a car racing organisation?
I agree with you about his recent activities, but I still think he's an idiot. He's made what I would perceive to be plenty of bad calls in his time. The most recent one I can think of was the American GP fiasco by not allowing a temporary chicane to be installed so that all the teams could race safely.
Everyone knows he is Ferrari biased and the only team to have gained anything by that chicane not being installed was Ferrari. The sooner he is gone and replaced by someone that has the sport truly at heart the better.
I thought the American GP was hilarious. It was a far judgement though - one tyre manufacturer made a bad call and the only way to level the playing field would have been to penalise the manufacturer who got it right - how could that be right?
F1's all about the money, anyway. Booooooooriiiiiing. What it needs is more eels.
I thought the American GP was hilarious. It was a far judgement though - one tyre manufacturer made a bad call and the only way to level the playing field would have been to penalise the manufacturer who got it right - how could that be right?
The ironic thing is, all teams (including Ferrari) agreed to the chicane.
F1's all about the money, anyway. Booooooooriiiiiing. What it needs is more eels.
:lol:
Supervox
04-06-08, 02:52 PM
The ironic thing is, all teams (including Ferrari) agreed to the chicane.
:lol:
Si, are you sure about that ?
I seem to remember ferrari stating that they were *against* an added chicane on the grounds that it wasn't their fault that Michelin hadn't brought suitable tyres - so why should they be punished ?
Si, are you sure about that ?
I seem to remember Ferrari stating that they were *against* an added chicane on the grounds that it wasn't their fault that Michelin hadn't brought suitable tyres - so why should they be punished ?
Egg on my face. :oops: After having done a bit of additional research, it was the Ferrari drivers who 'mentioned' they were not bothered about the chicane. As you stated, Ferrari (the team) were against it.
Spoiler Space (Just in case)
Just seen the recording of the race. Good on Kubica. Hamilton :thumbdown: I think even less of him now, i'd have tw4ted him one if i was Raikkonen.
Mike2165
10-06-08, 04:03 PM
Hamilton was brilliant in Monaco and Canada...he drove like his Dad did in the Porsche the week before!
thedonal
10-06-08, 04:24 PM
Maybe he just did it so his dad wouldn't feel so embarrassed!!!
Didn't the guy behind him join the party too? Only a fool breaks the bal blah etc
Mike2165
10-06-08, 06:38 PM
He did indeed.. and got away with it, went round and came in for a new nose. I'm not sure Lewis couldn't do the same, maybe felt like he shouldn't..very british!
Supervox
10-06-08, 08:35 PM
Interesting how some people would rather 'bash' one driver than comment on the positive parts of the race isn't it ?
Yep Hamilton made an error - one that he shouldn't have made - he held his hand up & said sorry to both Ferrari & Kimi personally - end of story.
Personally, much as I'd have enjoyed another Lewis win, his mistake made it a far more interesting race - he'd have just run away with otherwise.
Kubica drove a faultless race - although quite what would have happened if the accident hadn't occurred is a matter for conjecture - it looked as if Kimi was first to the pit exit & then Kubica pulled up alongside so, if he'd overtaken Kimi when the light turned green then he'd have been liable for a penalty for overtaking whilst under a safety car.
I bet Heidfeld is sick as a parrot that he didn't achieve BMW's first win - his face & actions whilst waiting for the presentation said it all I think.
Glad that Coulthard had some good luck for a change - he's had a miserable season so far - some of it his own making, some not.
Away from the race, who (if anyone) do other Org-ans see moving teams or losing their seat completely come the end of the season - or earlier perhaps ??
For me I think that Piquet Jnr will be lucky to last the season & I think that Vettel might well be on a few peoples 'wish' lists.
Roll on Magny-Cour & let's see what Lewis can do from a mid-field (at best) grid position.
Look Si - a whole post without any initials used !! :-)
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