View Full Version : midi files
does anyone understand them?
i have cubase but they midid file sounds rubbish unless i pay a man £7.50 per track to record it for me. Id really like to undertsand what it is he does and what i need to record my own tracks from midi. I thought VST done this but apparntly not.
Id prefer to ask people on here as other forums reagrding this come back with technical jargony speak and i prefer to keep things black and white
any one know how this is done
captainsmelly
16-09-09, 05:27 PM
I'm not using cubase, but isn't a midi file just a sequence of notes that is played through a vst plugin - whether thats a synth or sample trigger or whatever. Shouldn't sound of anything on its own, so the vst must be set up wrong if its not playing properly.
Unless you did what I kept doing, recording midi sequences far off the end of the virtual keyboard. That doesn't work.
Whats happening to your recordings?
im not getting anything.....Im not even sure i have the correct set up. I can play midi files through windows media player and they sound rubbish. what do i need to make them sound good?
Warthog
16-09-09, 05:33 PM
You basically need a good midi output sound card. I select on cubase in the "out" bit of midi tracks "Microsoft Wavetable GS Synth" or something like that, and the midi files play fine with the proper range of instruments. I am having troubles recording midi as audio in Cubase but that is a different problem if anyone fancies helping me with that!
You basically need a good midi output sound card. I select on cubase in the "out" bit of midi tracks "Microsoft Wavetable GS Synth" or something like that, and the midi files play fine with the proper range of instruments. I am having troubles recording midi as audio in Cubase but that is a different problem if anyone fancies helping me with that!
can i fit this to a laptop?
Warthog
16-09-09, 05:39 PM
This is where I set it, does this help?
Warthog
16-09-09, 05:40 PM
can i fit this to a laptop?
its a part of the soundcard, I'd have thought even onboard sound on a desktop has a decent enough midi synth, but I am not sure about a laptop, maybe they have worse onboard sound.
helps allot. im of to try it
Mike2165
16-09-09, 07:04 PM
I midi through a sound module/keyboard. The midi files choose the instrument and the sound mod/GM keyboard has the sounds, which are then amplifed or recorded as I need. Palying midi through the pc just uses the basic pc sounds. Oh and I connect usb to midi convertor and input to a midi sound mod/keyboard
Warthog
16-09-09, 07:05 PM
I midi through a sound module/keyboard. The midi files choose the instrument and the sound mod/GM keyboard has the sounds, which are then amplifed or recorded as I need. Palying midi through the pc just uses the basic pc sounds
Well yes, unless you have a decent sound card which I do. I think the issue is that Ross is using a laptop which might have very basic on-board sound.
thedonal
16-09-09, 08:27 PM
You should be able to import the midi file into Cubase.
It will (or should) then show each track seperately- drums, bass, guitars etc.
What you then need to do is choose some VST instruments (F11 to bring up your VST instruments window) and then assign each track to the relevant instrument so that it plays something.
You really need generic synths- such as IK Sampletank or Steinberg's Hypersonic (this is fantastic, by the way- great sound library).
These synths have a set of very useable multi-samples of guitars, basses, drums etc as well as synth sounds. They can play several different sounds at once (on different midi channels) so you can set the drums to midi channel 1, rhythm guitar to channel 2 etc.
Once you've done that, go to the track editor on the left hand side- you'll have an 'out' option- click on that and choose the appropriate VST synth and the correct channel for that sound.
thedonal
16-09-09, 08:35 PM
You basically need a good midi output sound card. I select on cubase in the "out" bit of midi tracks "Microsoft Wavetable GS Synth" or something like that, and the midi files play fine with the proper range of instruments. I am having troubles recording midi as audio in Cubase but that is a different problem if anyone fancies helping me with that!
Cubase is a bit rubbish for audio routing.
If you're using VST instruments-
The most straightforward way of doing this is to move the locators to the start and end of the track.
Go to File>Export>Audio Mixdown.
Choose the VST instrument you wish to record. Make sure it's a stereo interleaved mix (or mono as relevant) and click on the 'import to pool and create audio track' options (their exact names escape me but you'll see). Name the track as appropriate and click on OK.
Cubase will then make a recording of that track and bring it back in as an audio track.
For getting sounds from your GM synth back into Cubase, you need to look at the VST routing options (VST Audiobay). You may be able to choose the GM synth as a virtual external synth for Cubase. I haven't tried this, but it's worth a go-
Then you'll need to create some audio tracks- assign their inputs to GM synth connections you made in the VST audiobay.
Solo the parts you want to record, put the audio track into record ready mode and click on record- in theory, Cubase should play the synth, whilst recording the audio output from that synth into the relevant audio track you're recording on.
If any of the above makes sense, please let me know!! :D Hope it helps, anyway.
You should be able to import the midi file into Cubase.
It will (or should) then show each track seperately- drums, bass, guitars etc.
What you then need to do is choose some VST instruments (F11 to bring up your VST instruments window) and then assign each track to the relevant instrument so that it plays something.
You really need generic synths- such as IK Sampletank or Steinberg's Hypersonic (this is fantastic, by the way- great sound library).
These synths have a set of very useable multi-samples of guitars, basses, drums etc as well as synth sounds. They can play several different sounds at once (on different midi channels) so you can set the drums to midi channel 1, rhythm guitar to channel 2 etc.
Once you've done that, go to the track editor on the left hand side- you'll have an 'out' option- click on that and choose the appropriate VST synth and the correct channel for that sound.
ok im gertting somehwere now. thanks for this....Do i need to purchase a better sound card if i buy hypersonic? where does the file go when i press record?
thedonal
16-09-09, 09:15 PM
Yeah- if you start running more VST instruments, you'll need to get a soundcard otherwise you'll get horrible latency when you start playing/recording and the sound might break up.
Plus you'll get a better sound from a soundcard. If it's a laptop, you could choose a reasonably priced USB soundcard or something better that plugs in via a card.
thedonal
16-09-09, 09:17 PM
Incidentally, which version of Cubase are you running?
I'm on SX version 3.
Do you have a 'lite' version or full? It should do as I described above, but I'm not sure how limited it is...
Ceri JC
16-09-09, 11:14 PM
Midi always sounds gash. Even with a card with good midi instruments it's not going to sound too professional as there's no "production" applied to the sound. It's ultimately just note data. If you want to make a midi file sound as good as it possibly can, load up a load of different VSTs that excel at each of the different parts and use the midi to control them. Then engineer/master the track to get the parts sounding nice together.
I use midi on a computer in this way to control my outboard gear which actually makes all the sounds. It is a lot better than just loading a midi file into WMP. ;-)
Midi always sounds gash. Even with a card with good midi instruments it's not going to sound too professional as there's no "production" applied to the sound. It's ultimately just note data. If you want to make a midi file sound as good as it possibly can, load up a load of different VSTs that excel at each of the different parts and use the midi to control them. Then engineer/master the track to get the parts sounding nice together.
I use midi on a computer in this way to control my outboard gear which actually makes all the sounds. It is a lot better than just loading a midi file into WMP. ;-)
ok thanks Geri. Now i am totally ocnfused? heres what i need i think to understand what it is i need to do? (did that make sense?)
1. I have cubase. Nothing else. If i have to walk down to a shop and buy more stuff what do i need?
2. I load the file in cubase. I then play and i get no sound? I then can connect and get some really dodgy sound. how do i get it to sound great?
3. Where does the file go when you record? As it just seems to go no where?
4. Finally.How much will it cost me for someone to come and train me up on this for a hour?
thedonal
17-09-09, 08:32 AM
1) Depends what you want to do. For decent quality audio, you'll need an audio interface- for a USB unit I guess you'll be paying about £50-60 upwards- sky is the limit on these! Aside from that, a midi keyboard would have you up and creating your own stuff in no time.
Are you just using the midi files as something to jam along with on your guitar? Or do you want to start creating music with it?
2) Describe dodgy sound. Is it all broken up and distorted? That'll just be the built in sound card not really coping with the workload you're giving it.
3) Normally, if you open a new project, once you save your Cubase session, it'll create an audio folder. Any sound that you record into Cubase gets turned into a file in this folder.
4) I'm in Surrey- so it'd be a bit of a trip for me and am a bit busy for a few weeks yet. However, my folks live in Christchurch, so I could pop by when I'm next down that way. I wouldn't charge you. Cos I'm nice like that! There may also be someone else on the .org close enough to give you a hand.
I think you also need to let us know of your complete setup- what your laptop is (processor+speed and memory).
1) Depends what you want to do. For decent quality audio, you'll need an audio interface- for a USB unit I guess you'll be paying about £50-60 upwards- sky is the limit on these! Aside from that, a midi keyboard would have you up and creating your own stuff in no time.
Are you just using the midi files as something to jam along with on your guitar? Or do you want to start creating music with it?
2) Describe dodgy sound. Is it all broken up and distorted? That'll just be the built in sound card not really coping with the workload you're giving it.
3) Normally, if you open a new project, once you save your Cubase session, it'll create an audio folder. Any sound that you record into Cubase gets turned into a file in this folder.
4) I'm in Surrey- so it'd be a bit of a trip for me and am a bit busy for a few weeks yet. However, my folks live in Christchurch, so I could pop by when I'm next down that way. I wouldn't charge you. Cos I'm nice like that! There may also be someone else on the .org close enough to give you a hand.
I think you also need to let us know of your complete setup- what your laptop is (processor+speed and memory).
cool. well i use the drums from midi files that i buy from comtracks. i play in a duo and we use the drum sounds for a backing track. i have a HPG6000 Laptop. running cubase LE. i can get my hands on a midi keyboard quite quite a good one.The dodgy sound is like its a toy drum kit not the thumping tyoe i get when i pay comtracks to do the recording.
im in no rush to understand this so if you are ever dopwn this way i would really appreciate your help. Ill supply soem beer tokens for it!!!
ill get the keyboard this week. do i need somehting to convert the midi lead to a usb?
TheNinj1
17-09-09, 09:56 AM
Midi always sounds gash. Even with a card with good midi instruments it's not going to sound too professional as there's no "production" applied to the sound...
I use PT8 (LE) and love the MIDI instruments it uses, also using an MBox2 mini, M-audio studiophile AV40 monitors and M-Audio Keyrig 49 keyboard. If you like excellent music production, recording, mixing and writing, I'd definitely recommend ProTools 8.
I tried using Cubase a few times, and never got on with it. So i'm of no cubase help.
I use PT8 (LE) and love the MIDI instruments it uses, also using an MBox2 mini, M-audio studiophile AV40 monitors and M-Audio Keyrig 49 keyboard. If you like excellent music production, recording, mixing and writing, I'd definitely recommend ProTools 8.
I tried using Cubase a few times, and never got on with it. So i'm of no cubase help.
looking into t now
so i need a midi interface and a audio interface.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/KEY-FAX-PHAT-BOY-MIDI-CONTROLLER-EXC-CONDITION-_W0QQitemZ220443528479QQcmdZViewItem
would this do? would i still need the keyboard?
thedonal
17-09-09, 12:39 PM
Soz- at work, so can't view fleabay.
If you go for ProTools LE 8, you'll either need a Digidesign interface (they do a very basic usb one or the M-Box). I've not used 8, but I found 7 etc wasn't that good for midi.
If you wish to use Cubase, Novation do a small usb synth (XIO I think) which you can use as a midi interface (hell- it's got a keyboard, so that'll do!) and an Audio interface. My Bro's got one for dance music production (he doesn't use the sounds on the keyboard, but it's tiny and very useful).
I gues your duo is guitar and bass, plus vox and you're using the drums as a backing.
I used to be in a similar- guitar and vocalist. I made backing tracks that had the drums, bass, backing guitars/synths/orchestra. Made quite an art of it- but this was a few years ago now!
Warthog
17-09-09, 02:43 PM
Aaaaaah, thanks thedonal! I was routing the midi output to the soundcard, which was doing a good job of playing it, but wasn't routing back through cubase so as to enable an audio mixdown. I will try assigning VST instruments to the midi and then I think I can get a total audio mixdown. Why does it have to be so COMPLICATED! :D
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