View Full Version : Madeleine McCann
gettin2dizzy
07-09-07, 08:26 AM
who cares....:smt021
Thank you!!!!!!!
I thought it was just me!
harsh...................... but fair
You would care if she were your daughter.
Harsh but I see where you coming from... Face up to it Kate and Gerry - you shouldnt have left them alone!
SoulKiss
07-09-07, 08:43 AM
I hear the mother has now been made a suspect.
Is it just me or did they react VERY wierdly to it - flying all over Europe etc.
Its just the 1st of the "Celebrity Parent Victims", I think we can expect to see even more of it in the future - there was an element of this with that kid that got shot in Liverpool
As someone once posted, if they had left the kid with a baby-sitter and the baby sitter had popped out and this had happened then the baby-sitter would have been crucified by the press etc.
I feel sorry for their other kids who have been abandoned to relatives - they need their parents to be there for them - its not as if they wont know what is/has happened with the media circus thats going on.
Well, according to the news this morning her mums now a suspect(in the portugese sense of the law - me no comprende 100%)
fizzwheel
07-09-07, 08:48 AM
Its just the 1st of the "Celebrity Parent Victims"
I think this is my problem with the whole thing, its been splashed all over the media and I cant remember there ever being so much media hype about someting similar in the past.
I think its sad, they've lost their daughter, but I think it is their own fault, but they've gotta live with what they've done for the rest of their lives.
They should just leave the Portugese police to get on with it, they seem to spend all their energy on hyping up theirs and madelines plight in the media instead of concentrating on finding their daughter.
Trouble is their in a state of limbo, they wont be able to do anything until Madeline is found or her body is. It seems to me that they court the media attention.
gettin2dizzy
07-09-07, 08:50 AM
It's been clear its a dodgy case since the start. They've been demanding huge amounts of money from day one, they have even sold their 'we think we're going to be made suspects' story for this mornings papers! The DNA test results obviously have made some impact. Her blood splattered all over the flat...hmmz..
They're an odd couple
I though the BBC said she was still being treated as a witness??
YOu would have to be incredably stupid to so that to your own daughter and then make such a fuss andeffort to find her appeal etc.
To me i just dont think they done anything to her, it dosent add up, the ammount of coverage this has had they would have been implicated long ago.
I have sympathy for them due to the fact their little girl has gone i know how i would feel if it had been my duaghter gone missing, but on the other hand i am fed up with hearing about it and how they have become celebs over it. when the bottom line was its their fault she went missing, if they had bothered to twke the kids to eat with them or eaten in the appartment she would still be here now.
SoulKiss
07-09-07, 08:52 AM
You would care if she were your daughter.
Yeah, but she isn't so why should we?
Kids die and go missing ALL the time - its part of the world we live in.
Yes we should feel for them, just like following yesterdays news about Pavarotti dying, we should feel sorry for the family
But to put it in perspective, my Uncle also died yesterday, but why should anyone outside of my family care about that any less than Pav, but because he wasn't a famous "star", no-one who doesnt read this, or the Local Paper obituaries will know or care.
This story should have amounted to "Little Girl on Holiday goes missing from room", not turned into a huge media event with the parents jet-hopping over europe, getting audiences with the Pope and getting huge celebrity support etc.
Will be interesting to see how all those people react if it turns out the parents were involved.
fizzwheel
07-09-07, 08:54 AM
I though the BBC said she was still being treated as a witness??
Thats what the news on Radio 4 said last night, but now the BBC website is reporting that the mother is going to be made a suspect so the portuguese police can ask her another load of questions, but this isnt from the Portuguese police themselves, its a quote from a friend of the family... see more media fuss...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6982969.stm
Oh, well it will be interesting to see how that pans out then? obviously the DNA threw up some questions? ?
gettin2dizzy
07-09-07, 09:02 AM
they did it!
where pedrosa when you need him. Their legal system baffles me
Yeah, but she isn't so why should we?
I think this is one of the harshest statements I've ever read on this board.
I take a fundamentally different view of this to everyone else on this thread. The McCanns have done this media circus thing to keep their daughter in the public eye, precisely so that she doesn't slip out of public view. I can't blame them for that, in fact I admire their energy and devotion to the cause.
Yes they were downright stupid to leave their children unattended. What if there had been a fire - they could have lost all three children, not one.
But these people are not self-serving self-publicists. There is no evidence (in the public domain, anyway) linking them with abduction, murder, or anything else beyong stupidity and carelessness. Yes of course they should have known better, but fact is it's happened. You might say that they're closing the stable door after the horse has bolted, but if they did nothing they would be labelled as callous and uncaring.
I applaud their efforts to find their daughter. Were she mine, I would do exactly the same.
Death is natural. That's a harsh truth of the world.
Child abduction, however, is not.
Bluewolf
07-09-07, 09:05 AM
I have to say that this case has been getting on my bits for a while now. I wouldn't wish a missing/snatched child on my worst enemy, I'm sure the parents are going through Hell right now,
BUT...
When the situation first came to light they insisted the kid had been covered by the "babysitting service" on offer. Then they say they had actually been popping in every twenty minutes to check (which I don't believe for a second). Then it turns out that the house wasn't even locked and they'd actually left the patio doors open "to let fresh air in..."
Say the wee lassie (or either of her her infant siblings, who were also left unattended) had wandered into the garden, fallen in the pool and drowned. Would there be all the media fuss about the poor, dear parents, they must be devastated, blah, blah, blah..."
No, the media would be baying for their blood. Every time I see the scrawny mother clutching that stuffed toy and wearing an expression like a spaniel that's just been kicked, my blood pressure goes up about fifty points.
This story has dragged on for far too long and its most unfair to all the other parents who've had their children kidnapped too. Why should one missing child get so much more publicity compared to another? Especially when some blame can be put on the parents- they should never have left those children on their own.
I find the McCann's new celebrity status very disturbing. There was a news clip a while back when the parents flew to Morocco- private jet- and on arrival, a street lined with children waving banners with Madeleine's picture on!!!!
I think this is one of the harshest statements I've ever read on this board.
I take a fundamentally different view of this to everyone else on this thread. The McCanns have done this media circus thing to keep their daughter in the public eye, precisely so that she doesn't slip out of public view. I can't blame them for that, in fact I admire their energy and devotion to the cause.
Yes they were downright stupid to leave their children unattended. What if there had been a fire - they could have lost all three children, not one.
But these people are not self-serving self-publicists. There is no evidence (in the public domain, anyway) linking them with abduction, murder, or anything else beyong stupidity and carelessness. Yes of course they should have known better, but fact is it's happened. You might say that they're closing the stable door after the horse has bolted, but if they did nothing they would be labelled as callous and uncaring.
I applaud their efforts to find their daughter. Were she mine, I would do exactly the same.
Death is natural. That's a harsh truth of the world.
Child abduction, however, is not.
Not thought of it like that but i do agree of sorts.
however i do find the posters of her all over the placea bit OTT. Why put them in UK airports, if she came back in then she would have been picked up.
This story has dragged on for far too long and its most unfair to all the other parents who've had their children kidnapped too. Why should one missing child get so much more publicity compared to another? Especially when some blame can be put on the parents- they should never have left those children on their own.
Very good point and I'm sure that this is the reason why many of us aren't as sympathetic as Ed.
I find the McCann's new celebrity status very disturbing. There was a news clip a while back when the parents flew to Morocco- private jet- and on arrival, a street lined with children waving banners with Madeleine's picture on!!!!
+1 :smt013
and when the dad flew to the states to see how the yanks deal with these cases!! Like that is going to help. The portugeese police are capable of looking at how other forces do it on their own.
I bet he did not pay for that flight( probably first class) either??
SoulKiss
07-09-07, 09:15 AM
I think this is one of the harshest statements I've ever read on this board.
Harsh, yes, but I stand by it.
I think that unless they were instructed to not leave the country by the Portugese authority (which due to flights to Rome etc they obviously were not) they should have been back in Britain weeks ago looking after their other kids and helping THEM to deal with it. It must seem, I would imagine to the other kids that at the moment they have lost their parents as well as their sister, and it might make it harder for them to come to terms with their loss when their parents return but she doesnt.
Its just the way that this has played out causes me to be suspicious of the situation.
They could have still kept her in the public eye with other methods.
Jelster
07-09-07, 09:22 AM
I think this is one of the harshest statements I've ever read on this board.
I take a fundamentally different view of this to everyone else on this thread. The McCanns have done this media circus thing to keep their daughter in the public eye, precisely so that she doesn't slip out of public view. I can't blame them for that, in fact I admire their energy and devotion to the cause.
Yes they were downright stupid to leave their children unattended. What if there had been a fire - they could have lost all three children, not one.
But these people are not self-serving self-publicists. There is no evidence (in the public domain, anyway) linking them with abduction, murder, or anything else beyong stupidity and carelessness. Yes of course they should have known better, but fact is it's happened. You might say that they're closing the stable door after the horse has bolted, but if they did nothing they would be labelled as callous and uncaring.
I applaud their efforts to find their daughter. Were she mine, I would do exactly the same.
Death is natural. That's a harsh truth of the world.
Child abduction, however, is not.
Well said.
2 points:
1) You are innocent until proven guilty, the day that fundamental part of our society changes we are all doomed
2) The Portuguese investigative/criminal system is a joke. Why did British police have to go in and deal with evidence ? There is pressure on the Portuguese Authorities to find an answer, and they may well do that any way they can....
.
They could have still kept her in the public eye with other methods.
Agreed, and to be fair with all the latest developments appearing on SKY, BBD, papers etc , surley it must be eaiser for who ever has done this to hide, get away, etc??
Dave The Rave
07-09-07, 09:24 AM
Hmmm ... the sad thing is that in cases like this it is very often someone from the close family/friends who gets involved. I am not saying they have done it but surelly they were guilty of neglect at least?
If the same happened to a low income family from a council estate they would slaughter them in papers for not being responsible parents. However as they were "well off" parents they were shown as victims instead!
Yes they suffered a terrible loss and will have to live with it for rest of their lifes. But what cheeses me off the most is that there never was and never will be the same rule for everyone. It seems pretty similar to the OJ Simpson case where instead of concentrating on the base of the problem all the lawers did was divert the attention of the media to something totally irelevant to save their client.
I just hope that there will not be a massive turnaround and we will not hear they did it themselves for whatever reason. Unfortunatelly I think that's what the press and TV is waiting for. Another story to shock us all!
Ceri JC
07-09-07, 09:25 AM
On the one hand, whilst I think they were negligent in leaving them alone (particularly not locked in), I don't think they killed her and I completely understand the way they have used the media (very well, I might add) to keep people on the look out for her. On the other, I am a bit bored of the story now and it just keeps regurgitating the same old thing, covering old ground, because there hasn't been any news or breakthrough. Also, as Melody says, there are lots more worthwhile things that press could be covering (where the coverage might solve other crimes).
This story has dragged on for far too long and its most unfair to all the other parents who've had their children kidnapped too. Why should one missing child get so much more publicity compared to another? Especially when some blame can be put on the parents- they should never have left those children on their own.
I find the McCann's new celebrity status very disturbing. There was a news clip a while back when the parents flew to Morocco- private jet- and on arrival, a street lined with children waving banners with Madeleine's picture on!!!!
My sentiments exactly.
MiniMatt
07-09-07, 09:47 AM
Too early for humour?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v600/drjezzball/badgers/b3ta.png
I know, very bad taste, I'm probably going to hell for that...
gettin2dizzy
07-09-07, 09:48 AM
I feel a poll coming on...
"mods!" :)
DanAbnormal
07-09-07, 09:59 AM
I agree totally with Mr Ed's comments on this. If it were my child I would want the world to know as it can only increase the chance she could be found alive or otherwise. Yes the parents were a little careless, but this could easily happen to so many of us. I think we forget the real crime here is how the media use the story. They care upto a point but to them it's much more about making money, which is the real evil of our time.
Pedro68
07-09-07, 10:01 AM
I'm with Ed on this one ... well said Ed.
The parents have been incredibly stupid - that you cannot deny.
Whether they are guilty of anything more is not for "us" to decide.
We can only speculate on that (innocent until proven guilty as Jelster says).
I think the parents are in a no-win situation.
If they court media interest they are being accused of over-hyping it.
If they don't the media will hound them anyway, or people will accuse them of not caring enough.
I don't agree with (or recognise) their "celebrity" status, and I do agree that other methods could have been used to generate such publicity as I find it a bit strange that they aren't spending as much time with their other children as I think (personally) they ought to ... if I lost a child, I'd make damn sure I barely let my remaining child(ren) out of my sight. I wouldn't be jetting off to see the Pope (et al).
That's my opinion on it.
Oh and I disagree with ya Soulkiss on the bit about the parents of Rhys (the young boy who was shot in Liverpool the other week). An entirely INNOCENT 11 year old child was shot and killed by what would appear to be a "young person on a BMX bike". That news is bound to make headlines ... and so the parents are bound to end up in the media spotlight. Rhys was an avid young footballer and I think it speaks VOLUMES that players from his beloved Everton FC attended the funeral, amongst what was bound to be a media frenzy - if anything I'd be castigating the media for their intrusions, but at the end of the day, they are doing their jobs (like it or loathe - if they didn't we wouldn't be discussing it here!). Also "gun crime" is becoming a sad fact of life in Britain these days, and if it unites an otherwise split community (based on which team they support) then the parents can hardly be blamed for "highlighting" that.
Pete
I'm with the minority Ed, Dan and Pedro.
I don't blame the parents for trying to keep the story in the media etc but like others have mentioned it sucks that the media have leapt onto this story to the detriment of others.
If I REALLY REALLY REALLY cared about every story about every missing/killed child/adult I would constantly be a nervous sobbing wreck.
I don't blame the parents for trying to keep the story in the media etc but like others have mentioned it sucks that the media have leapt onto this story to the detriment of others.
If I REALLY REALLY REALLY cared about every story about every missing/killed child/adult I would constantly be a nervous sobbing wreck.
Agreed i would be a mess too
Dave The Rave
07-09-07, 10:21 AM
I think the parents are in a no-win situation.
If they court media interest they are being accused of over-hyping it.
If they don't the media will hound them anyway, or people will accuse them of not caring enough.
Pete
Not sure ... 'cause if they did not cause all the fuss in the first place no one would know and no one would care. I don't know the stats but I am sure there are many kids abducted every year. You just don't hear about them. And are the media hunting those parenst down and blaming them for not hyping it up? No.
We all judge the case based on the TV and papers coverage but we know nothing about the real facts. The police does and I am sure you will solve the case sooner rather than later.
I hear the mother has now been made a suspect.
Is it just me or did they react VERY wierdly to it - flying all over Europe etc.
Its just the 1st of the "Celebrity Parent Victims", I think we can expect to see even more of it in the future - there was an element of this with that kid that got shot in Liverpool
As someone once posted, if they had left the kid with a baby-sitter and the baby sitter had popped out and this had happened then the baby-sitter would have been crucified by the press etc.
I feel sorry for their other kids who have been abandoned to relatives - they need their parents to be there for them - its not as if they wont know what is/has happened with the media circus thats going on.
Absolutely spot on
"Who Cares" - That is one of the worst things I've seen on here, Whatever terrible things have or are continuing to happen to Madeleine she does not deserve them.
SoulKiss
07-09-07, 10:30 AM
I'm with Ed on this one ... well said Ed.
The parents have been incredibly stupid - that you cannot deny.
Whether they are guilty of anything more is not for "us" to decide.
We can only speculate on that (innocent until proven guilty as Jelster says).
I think the parents are in a no-win situation.
If they court media interest they are being accused of over-hyping it.
If they don't the media will hound them anyway, or people will accuse them of not caring enough.
I don't agree with (or recognise) their "celebrity" status, and I do agree that other methods could have been used to generate such publicity as I find it a bit strange that they aren't spending as much time with their other children as I think (personally) they ought to ... if I lost a child, I'd make damn sure I barely let my remaining child(ren) out of my sight. I wouldn't be jetting off to see the Pope (et al).
That's my opinion on it.
Oh and I disagree with ya Soulkiss on the bit about the parents of Rhys (the young boy who was shot in Liverpool the other week). An entirely INNOCENT 11 year old child was shot and killed by what would appear to be a "young person on a BMX bike". That news is bound to make headlines ... and so the parents are bound to end up in the media spotlight. Rhys was an avid young footballer and I think it speaks VOLUMES that players from his beloved Everton FC attended the funeral, amongst what was bound to be a media frenzy - if anything I'd be castigating the media for their intrusions, but at the end of the day, they are doing their jobs (like it or loathe - if they didn't we wouldn't be discussing it here!). Also "gun crime" is becoming a sad fact of life in Britain these days, and if it unites an otherwise split community (based on which team they support) then the parents can hardly be blamed for "highlighting" that.
Pete
Given your location, I think that you may be closer to the Rhys case than me.
I didnt say that they HAD become like the Maddy case, just that at times it was reminiscent of it from the soundbites etc that were coming out of it.
I was not trying to tie these cases together - the Rhys case is completely different to the Maddy case in so many ways.
Maybe its because I believe that you shouldnt have to appeal on TV before people who know things about crimes come forwards, I mean why does it take someone on TV appealing for witnessed to come forwards for them to suddenly see that this is the right thing to do, why were they not down the local police station as soon as they could be.
My view is that why should I care about this one little girl more than any other missing child, just because her parents shouted loudest and longest.
Look at the stories in the press at the moment about the Vietnamese kids that are being kidnapped to work in Cannabis Factories in this country.
Dont they deserve the same attention ?
the trouble is we only know what we're told and the media are reknowned for fabricating things to rouse the public i hope where evershe is they are looking after her poor little lass
The problem I have as a parent is that they shouldnt have left the young girl alone in the first place, but also there doesnt seem to have been any kind of public showing of grief, if one of my kids got abducted I wouldnt be able to hold back my hurt, anger, helplessness and frustration and Id want everyone to know about it.
The problem I have as a parent is that they shouldnt have left the young girl alone in the first place, but also there doesnt seem to have been any kind of public showing of grief, if one of my kids got abducted I wouldnt be able to hold back my hurt, anger, helplessness and frustration and Id want everyone to know about it.
Oh and I do care btw, just dont give a toss about the parents
I think this is one of the harshest statements I've ever read on this board.
I take a fundamentally different view of this to everyone else on this thread. The McCanns have done this media circus thing to keep their daughter in the public eye, precisely so that she doesn't slip out of public view. I can't blame them for that, in fact I admire their energy and devotion to the cause.
Yes they were downright stupid to leave their children unattended. What if there had been a fire - they could have lost all three children, not one.
But these people are not self-serving self-publicists. There is no evidence (in the public domain, anyway) linking them with abduction, murder, or anything else beyong stupidity and carelessness. Yes of course they should have known better, but fact is it's happened. You might say that they're closing the stable door after the horse has bolted, but if they did nothing they would be labelled as callous and uncaring.
I applaud their efforts to find their daughter. Were she mine, I would do exactly the same.
Death is natural. That's a harsh truth of the world.
Child abduction, however, is not.
Well said Ed, I agree with you entirely.
SoulKiss
07-09-07, 10:44 AM
The problem I have as a parent is that they shouldnt have left the young girl alone in the first place, but also there doesnt seem to have been any kind of public showing of grief, if one of my kids got abducted I wouldnt be able to hold back my hurt, anger, helplessness and frustration and Id want everyone to know about it.
I think thats what keeps grating on my nerves.
It must be a terrible thing to have happen to you, in fact even tho I dont know them or the poor girl, if I happened to find her and whoever took her, well there would not be much need for "proper police and judicial procedures", other than to bag and tag him. I would probably be the same for any child I saw being abused.
Its just that the reaction of her parents feels SO wrong to me, maybe they are bottling it up so that they can continue their campaign, but my gut feeling is that there is something wrong with their actions and reactions.
Which is probably why I feel the way I do towards them, they make me suspicious of them, which when it comes down to it is my issue, not theirs.
So to perhaps rephrase what has been said by me before, do I care that a little girl is missing or dead - yes I do, do I care for the way her parents are dealing with it, no I dont. Its the case/media circus I dont care about.
Thanks Ed, tho I kind of rejected your point earlier - it did make me think some more about my actual thoughts on the matter.
Also, Pedro - thanks
Biker Biggles
07-09-07, 10:44 AM
Ill reserve my judgement on much of the above until we actually have some sort of result,or at least the publication of the real evidence rather than what the media make up and publish.
One thing that does worry me though is the money.This must now be a million pound business and where is that money coming from and in whose interest is it being generated and spent?
I also care about the little girl, but I don't care about anything which won't help her get found.
The theme of the press at the moment is all around "who dunnit" and much less about efforts to actually find Madeline.
I think it's a slightly negative reflection on our society, that for a tragic event to be news worthy, it has to be unusual or bizarre, and not simply tragic. It doesn't even matter who is involved, it's all about how odd, spectacular or violent it was, and then we treat it like it was the only tragic event to have taken place.
I'm with the minority Ed, Dan and Pedro.
And Jabba.
I admire them for trying everything they can to get their kid back. Too many "knockers" in this thread for my personal liking, offering comments and observations upon a situation without understand how they would react if it were them.
How many people making these cruel comments have kids of their own? I bet some of the harshest comment have been made by those not fortunate enough to have.
It is the media who've turned them into "celebrities"; I doubt very much that that was their intention and that they would willing slip back into obscurity if they could have their kid back.
gettin2dizzy
07-09-07, 11:09 AM
It is the media who've turned them into "celebrities"; I doubt very much that that was their intention and that they would willing slip back into obscurity if they could have their kid back.
They've been milking the press, playing them against each other for the highest price. Offering 'specials' which are about them. Todays story they sold to the mail was about her being made a victim. NOT about her efforts to find her...
And Jabba.
I admire them for trying everything they can to get their kid back. Too many "knockers" in this thread for my personal liking, offering comments and observations upon a situation without understand how they would react if it were them.
How many people making these cruel comments have kids of their own? I bet some of the harshest comment have been made by those not fortunate enough to have.
It is the media who've turned them into "celebrities"; I doubt very much that that was their intention and that they would willing slip back into obscurity if they could have their kid back.
Totally understand what you,re saying mate just finding it hard to sympathise with such a cool detached couple of people, which actually may be more of a reflection on me, just know how I would react if one of my daughters was abducted. One other thing, they have two other kids, why are they not seen to be with them more often ?
ASM-Forever
07-09-07, 11:17 AM
Well i'm watching channel 4 news and it seems the mother has just been formally questioned and the father is due to be questioned.. Apparently the next step is to formally charge them.
I wasn't paying much attention, but it seems they found the girls blood in a hire car, the parents rented after her abduction.
I'm sure the BBC will explain more thoroughly for those interested.
gettin2dizzy
07-09-07, 11:24 AM
well, to put it another way.... the hunt for her stopped a while ago...
Alpinestarhero
07-09-07, 11:30 AM
I do care, I really do. But, in all honesty, I think there is very very little chance of finding her alive now.
As much as I hope I am proved wrong, I don't hold out much hope. I admire the family's determination and continuing efforts, plus their positive attitude...but its high time they thought seriously about the potential, and more likley, truth that she is no longer alive. They should come home, back to england, and get along with their lives. They have other children to consider, what about their education?
Matt
As a parent i can feel for the McCanns, but to be labelled a "celebrity parent" is a bit harsh, in the case of the shooting of Rhys his parent will probably become campaigners for anti gun crime and because it was such a high profile case i wish them all the luck in the world,If they can save one more life from it then it will be a campaign well worth doing.
What will the MCanns be campaigning for "dont leave your kids unattended whilst you go out on a jolly"
Yes there actions were totally wrong and selfish, if they are innocent they have got to live with the guilt for the rest of thier lives, if on the other hand they're found guilty then they deserve everything thats coming to them,
Rant over
thedonal
07-09-07, 11:41 AM
I also agree that there is, sadly, little hope for Madeleine.
However, as far as the rest of it is concerned- I really don't know what to make of it all. The more time elapses, the less hope in solving the mystery there is. Perhaps we will never find out everything.
gettin2dizzy
07-09-07, 11:42 AM
She's now a suspect. The way Portugese law works is similar to our own. As a witness she has to speak, and has to answer any question by police. By making her a suspect means she has the right to remain silent - ie not to incriminate yourself. This is only done if they are questionning her innocence.
Sky news are also reporting that they found her blood in the hire car....it's looking very dodgy.
But - I can understand them trying to mask an accidental death, such as with them being doctors having access to medication (there was hints that they had drugges her), but splashes of blood?! That suggests butchering!!
The police in Portugal aren't allowed to release information like the police over here. However they abruptly stopped the search for her, and are pursuing a murder charge. I think it's safe to say that she is definately dead.
Manguish
07-09-07, 11:44 AM
Thought you didn't care? :p
gettin2dizzy
07-09-07, 11:46 AM
lol - I just hate the campaign the most, wasting time at work is just an importnat part of my day ;)
they found blood in the hire car? well case solved then.
oh hang on. kids fall over all the time, they bump scrape and cut themselves pretty much on a daily basis. to find her blood in the hire car isnt something i reckon the police would pin their hopes on.
gettin2dizzy
07-09-07, 11:48 AM
they found blood in the hire car? well case solved then.
oh hang on. kids fall over all the time, they bump scrape and cut themselves pretty much on a daily basis. to find her blood in the hire car isnt something i reckon the police would pin their hopes on.
...that they hired after the "abduction" (sorry - missed the important part!)
Red ones
07-09-07, 11:49 AM
YOu would have to be incredably stupid to so that to your own daughter and then make such a fuss andeffort to find her appeal etc.
or suffering Munchausen's by proxy!!!
You would care if she were your daughter.
Or if you had parted money at one of the many collections supporting them over the last few months, essentially giving your money direct to a suspect in a murder enquiry that has yet to determine the perpetrator.
...that they hired after the "abduction" (sorry - missed the important part!)
er yeah fairly improtant that bit :D
i stand corrected
Dave The Rave
07-09-07, 11:59 AM
well, to put it another way.... the hunt for her stopped a while ago...
:winner:
enough said!
Bluewolf
07-09-07, 12:15 PM
One other thing, they have two other kids, why are they not seen to be with them more often ?
I've wondered about that myself. If one of my kids (hypothetically speaking you understand) had been snatched from right under my nose I'd be damned if I'd let the other two out of my sight. :cyclopsani:
i see the mother has gone from witness to a suspect now
You know what, i have given up caring. Yes, its all very sad and i for one would not wish it on anyone, but shes not the only one to go missing ever, and sadly wont be the last. If shes gone and is still alive, i hope they find her, if shes dead, i hope they find her and who done it. I still have a sneaky suspision that the parents had something to do with it. If im wrong then good and i hope i am.
Alpinestarhero
07-09-07, 01:57 PM
You know what, i have given up caring. Yes, its all very sad and i for one would not wish it on anyone, but shes not the only one to go missing ever, and sadly wont be the last. If shes gone and is still alive, i hope they find her, if shes dead, i hope they find her and who done it. I still have a sneaky suspision that the parents had something to do with it. If im wrong then good and i hope i am.
I agree
Matt
And Jabba.
I admire them for trying everything they can to get their kid back. Too many "knockers" in this thread for my personal liking, offering comments and observations upon a situation without understand how they would react if it were them.
How many people making these cruel comments have kids of their own? I bet some of the harshest comment have been made by those not fortunate enough to have.
Yes, I'm one of those not fortunate enough to have children of my own, but that certainly doesn't make me any less capable of being as caring as a parent would.
I think the initial statement of 'who cares' was not aimed directly at Madeleine. It would take a very stone hearted person to not care a tiny bit that an innocent four year old was abducted and God knows what else she's been through.
What grates on most people is the publicity surrounding this story. I'm not aware of the statistics, but I imagine there are many children that go missing every year. Don't they ALL deserve this publicity? How are all the other parents with missing children meant to feel. Their children are not as important?
Then there is MY perception of the McCanns.
The children should never have been left on their own in the first place. But thats now by the by.I'm sure if they could turn back the clock, this woudn't have happened.
How about their other two children? Not only have they lost a sister, but now they hardly see their parents. I don't doubt that it must be incredibly difficult if not impossible to try to carry on, but surely for the sake of their two other children they could?
As far as the 'celebrity' status. I PERSONALLY found the news clip of the McCanns arriving in Morocco quite disturbing. I find it very difficult to warm to either of them. I've never seen them appear to be distressed or distraught, but on the other hand, I accept that everyone grieves differently.
I think most people do care, for Maddy, a very innocent victim. But the way I care for my family and friends cannot be the same way I would care for a stranger. If we all cared the same way for every single person that was shot, stabbed, murdered, abducted etc, then the nation would be in a perpetual state of mourning.
But what do I know, I'm not a parent.
fizzwheel
07-09-07, 02:23 PM
I've never seen them appear to be distressed or distraught, but on the other hand, I accept that everyone grieves differently.
I dont think they are greiving at all, I expect its pretty difficult to greive when you dont know if your daughter is dead or alive.
I think they're just "Diverting" i.e. they're focused on other things i.e the media, publicity etc as its easier to do stuff like this than confront and face up to the reality of what they've done and whats happened.
I had a similar thing with one of my friends when my friend died last year, its f*cking difficult to reach somebody when they've emotionally shut down which alot of people do in this kind of situation and that might be why they dont appear distressed or distraught...
Having watched my Brother and Sister in law go through hell since they lost their baby daughter in January I can actually relate to what the McGann's are going through. Its horrible I wouldnt wish it on anybody.
I just dont think that anybody at the moment really knows, but I think that the portuguese police work in a very different way to the british police and that is also alot of the problem, I dont think it helped that the britsh media called the portuguese police incompentant at the start of all of this either.
I'd imagine now with all the media scrunity they are being extra careful and covering everything off, and that eventually I'd like to think that they get to the bottom of what happened to madeline and catch the people that did it.
I think the one true victim in all of this is Madeline herself and that the McGanns and the press have forgotten that and its turning into a media circus revolving around them and the focus has been lost from finding Madeline.
busasean
07-09-07, 02:30 PM
I think this is one of the harshest statements I've ever read on this board.
I take a fundamentally different view of this to everyone else on this thread. The McCanns have done this media circus thing to keep their daughter in the public eye, precisely so that she doesn't slip out of public view. I can't blame them for that, in fact I admire their energy and devotion to the cause.
Yes they were downright stupid to leave their children unattended. What if there had been a fire - they could have lost all three children, not one.
But these people are not self-serving self-publicists. There is no evidence (in the public domain, anyway) linking them with abduction, murder, or anything else beyong stupidity and carelessness. Yes of course they should have known better, but fact is it's happened. You might say that they're closing the stable door after the horse has bolted, but if they did nothing they would be labelled as callous and uncaring.
I applaud their efforts to find their daughter. Were she mine, I would do exactly the same.
Death is natural. That's a harsh truth of the world.
Child abduction, however, is not.
couldnt agree more.
barmy.biker
07-09-07, 03:16 PM
who in their right mind would leave their kids home alone, especialy in a foriegn country and then go out on the town
Pedrosa
07-09-07, 05:01 PM
There are so many aspects to this case that deeply concern me and raise many questions. Doting parents,(he a Heart Consultant and she a G.P.) even that in my mind doesnt quite ring right. Both in professions where one has to remain somewhat aloof and cold headed. They might well love their kids but doting? Hmmmm.
But leaving that alone, the methods and timing of activities by the Portugese Authorities? They are being made to look a laughing stock but am sure they are not. It is just their system is different.
The action taken against Kate now, is to allow them to be able to question her further. It does not at this time make her the prime suspect.
But I am not supporting or criticising anyone,all I know is that a small bundle of inocence has been the centre piece of a tale that might have an ending that still beggars belief.
Blue Flame
07-09-07, 05:21 PM
who in their right mind would leave their kids home alone, especialy in a foriegn country and then go out on the town
See this is for me where it and all the other stupid posts like it just get's out of proportion and start trying to paint pictures that are simply not true. Now they were out on the town were they ?? Comment on the facts and don't make up stories or speculations.
All the 'holidaymakers' in the background on SKY news made you disgusted to be British. It was clear they were all on the phone back home sayin 'Can you see me on the telly !!'.
It's all sick.
Now they were out on the town were they ?? Comment on the facts and don't make up stories or speculations.
It's all sick.
well, yes they were, at the end of the day they went out and left the kids alone, they did not pop next door, they went out for a meal, leaving 2 very yong childrun alone
they are both inteligant people with good jobs
somthing IMO is not right
Blue Flame
07-09-07, 05:34 PM
As far as I am aware, they were not far away and they were checking every half hour. I am not saying that is right or wrong but the quote 'out on the town' paints a somewhat different picture don't you think.
Something may well be in your opinion 'not right' but untill the facts come out they are innocent.
There was a large family group who were there on the night who have been commenting today on the state of the mother when the child was discovered 'missing'.
Nobody knows what happened at this stage and at the moment I give them the benefit of the doubt. Do not focus on one piece of 'evidence'.
Bluewolf
07-09-07, 08:44 PM
I just wonder if the family was targeted for an abduction? Perhaps it wasn't the first time they'd done it so the perpetrator knew that the doors would be unlocked and that the kids would be home alone.
Pure speculation on my part of course, but it just seems too neat a job for an opportunist.
a girl at work said she had heard on radio that the parents had drugged the kids as they were criers. probably why they were happy to go out for meal, knowing kids would not wake up.
Bluewolf
07-09-07, 08:56 PM
I heard that rumour too KK
fizzwheel
07-09-07, 09:24 PM
a girl at work said she had heard on radio that the parents had drugged the kids as they were criers. probably why they were happy to go out for meal, knowing kids would not wake up.
Liz was saying about this earlier on, she said, they're both Dr's they drugged the kids and went out, and something went wrong so they're probably trying to cover up for it.
I dont know if theres anything to back it up, but I guess its a plausible enough theory.
Pedrosa
07-09-07, 09:35 PM
A woman who actually lives directly above the apartment in which the McCann's were renting has stated that the previous night,she heard Madeline crying for something like 75 minutes non stop. This immediately brings in to question the half hour checks made as mentioned by the parents.
This all feels so bad.........
kwak zzr
07-09-07, 09:39 PM
i dont know what to think? i just hope justice prevails and nothing underhanded goes on,
its the children at the end of the day i worry about.
MR UKI (1)
07-09-07, 09:46 PM
It would be most shocking if something underhand had happened, particularly with all the publicity (meeting with pope, celebrity appeals by David Beckham to name but one and posters everywhere etc) that have taken place. To go to that extent would suggest the 'disappearance' is completely genuine, but i suppose only time will tell.
Warthog
07-09-07, 10:02 PM
OK I am not one to be a rumour monger in particular, but this one is a real doozy. My friend has a friend who works at the Guardian, who says although it is not in the news yet, Kate McCann is about to be charged with murder.
You heard it here first, unless it is false, then you "ain't seen me" (fast show) ;)
OK I am not one to be a rumour monger in particular, but this one is a real doozy. My friend has a friend who works at the Guardian, who says although it is not in the news yet, Kate McCann is about to be charged with murder.
You heard it here first, unless it is false, then you "ain't seen me" (fast show) ;)
Maybe it's closer to the news (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/09/07/nmaddy907.xml)than we think. I've said since day one that the parents were involved. I hope I'm wrong.
toonyank
07-09-07, 11:44 PM
Maybe it's closer to the news (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/09/07/nmaddy907.xml)than we think. I've said since day one that the parents were involved. I hope I'm wrong.
I hope you're right. Only because if you're wrong they will never find anything.
I think they should have been made suspects from the very beginnig, leaving a child "alone".
They've always took this very well in my eyes. I have two children 11 and 8 and I don't even think I could speak without breaking down if anything happened to either one of mine
northwind
08-09-07, 01:25 AM
One thing I thought was just plain mental... In Glasgow, about 3 weeks after she went missing, they still had her up on the big missing person screen in town. They took down an appeal to find a local schizophrenic man who'd vanished, to replace it with a kid who'd gone missing in another country. "Well, you never know". :smt092
Warthog
08-09-07, 08:03 AM
If it turns out that they did kill her, they are going to be the most loathed couple in the history of the world. Think of all the free jets they were loaned, all the people paying into a reward fund, all the facebook groups; even the pope will want an apology!
OK I am not one to be a rumour monger in particular, but this one is a real doozy. My friend has a friend who works at the Guardian, who says although it is not in the news yet, Kate McCann is about to be charged with murder.
You heard it here first, unless it is false, then you "ain't seen me" (fast show) ;)
I DON'T CARE!
wheelnut
08-09-07, 08:34 AM
I think they should just stop giving them air time, especially that sniffling husband. His voice grates on me
grh1904
08-09-07, 09:23 AM
Nobody likes to be duped, taken advantage of, have the wool pulled over their eyes etc,
Now, I'm not saying the parents are involved, but the press coverage has really taken a different turn, and what does worry me is if the parents have had an involvement and duped the press and public.
The saying "HELL HATH NO FURY LIKE A WOMAN SCORNED", starts to pop up here,
Imagine the press as the woman scorned, what next of the coverage.
Hundreds of thousands of people have become involved in the search for this kid, many of then paying lots of their own money to help.
I've never really known what to make of this case, right from the start. I was shocked and horrified when the news first broke, felt for the parents, hoped she would be found alive and well, and put the lack of outward worry & grief from the parents as being because they held out hope for her to be found alive & it hadn't quite sunk in yet. Over time the lack of outward grief was because they come to terms with it.
Now I'm starting to feel a bit angry that I might have had my good nature etc taken advantage of. If, and I stress the use of the word "IF", the parents have had an involvemnent or knowledge of, right from the begining, then I'm upset and angry that they tried to trick me into believing that they were innocent all along.
Alpinestarhero
08-09-07, 09:28 AM
grh - this is the danger now. If the evidence dosnt show otherwise, and only shows that the parents are wholly involved in the dissapearance (it hasnt been shown she's dead yet) of madeline, then I think everyone involved has a right to be angry with them, It would be disgusting, since they have lead everyone on for weeks and weeks.
Yet, I dont think they did it. It just dosnt make sense to me
Matt
grh - this is the danger now. If the evidence dosnt show otherwise, and only shows that the parents are wholly involved in the dissapearance (it hasnt been shown she's dead yet) of madeline, then I think everyone involved has a right to be angry with them, It would be disgusting, since they have lead everyone on for weeks and weeks.
Yet, I dont think they did it. It just dosnt make sense to me
Matt
I know what you mean it doesn't make sense even tho "evidence" they reckon says otherwise
god help them if they are guilty
Alpinestarhero
08-09-07, 09:43 AM
I know what you mean it doesn't make sense even tho "evidence" they reckon says otherwise
god help them if they are guilty
It seems that its something the portugese are saying just to make a quick end. They are stating that if the parents / mother confesses to the murduer of madeline, then she'll only spend two years in jail
Matt
RhythmJunkie
08-09-07, 12:50 PM
Doctors drugging their children to make them sleep isn't sinister in itself, they could have used Dopamine which is harmless, but to then leave the children without any supervision whatsoever in an unlocked holiday apartment in an unfamiliar area is strange behaviour, especially for a couple who are so highly educated and trained primarily in caring for people.
The whole scenario is very suspicious and too many things don't add up!
Just because they are doctors doesn't mean they have angels wings and are above breaking the law! Remember Harold Shipman to name but one!
Also, statistically, most child murders are commited by another family member!
The whole reason this is front page is 'one', because they are both doctors and 'two', too many odd unexplainables!!
Mrs McCann looks to me like she has nerves made from titanium!!:rolleyes:
By now she should look like death itself, tired and pale, not bouncey and smiling as if she's off to the beach for the day instead of a murder inquiry on her own daughter! :confused:
gettin2dizzy
08-09-07, 01:01 PM
As I said earlier, they search stopped abruptly, that only suggests that they found her. The Portuguese police are not allowed to disclose ANY information, unless deemed critical. "If" they have found her they aren't allowed to say so. However to charge someone with the 'accidental' death, as well as frequently mentioning drugging a child they need the supporting evidence. That only suggests they have the body - and it contains a stupidly high level of some kind of tranquiliser. I don't see any other way they could suggest such an incident.
This case is only getting interesting now that there's some action ;)
As I said earlier, they search stopped abruptly, that only suggests that they found her. The Portuguese police are not allowed to disclose ANY information, unless deemed critical. "If" they have found her they aren't allowed to say so. However to charge someone with the 'accidental' death, as well as frequently mentioning drugging a child they need the supporting evidence. That only suggests they have the body - and it contains a stupidly high level of some kind of tranquiliser. I don't see any other way they could suggest such an incident.
This case is only getting interesting now that there's some action ;)
Surmise, supposition, jumping to conclusions, and ill-informed guesswork.
Biker Biggles
08-09-07, 02:18 PM
Quite correct ED.Your post nicely sums up the entire story from start to present day.
This must now be a million pound business and where is that money coming from and in whose interest is it being generated and spent?
It's probably not a million pound business in it's own right. The newspapers and TV will probably have spent lots of money on it that they would have spent on other stories had other stories captured the publics attention during that time. The fact that the story has been going on so long is due to the fact that there is a lot of public interest in it, and it's been a relatively slow period for other news (Before anyone jumps down my throat, I'm not for a second implying that nothing else has happened, but nothing else that tugs the emotional heartstrings like a very photogenic blond-haired blue-eyed little girl will. Media is a business, it's all about the profit I'm afraid.
How about their other two children? Not only have they lost a sister, but now they hardly see their parents. I don't doubt that it must be incredibly difficult if not impossible to try to carry on, but surely for the sake of their two other children they could?
Not picking on you particularly Melody, but everyone here seems to assume that the parents are not spending any time with the other kids: why? Because they aren't at the press conferences? Maybe the parents have decided that for the good of the other kids it's best to keep them out of the spotlight? I don't know. Maybe they have abandoned the other kids, but nothing states that outright to me. If anyone has evidence, please correct me.
who in their right mind would leave their kids home alone, especialy in a foriegn country and then go out on the town
Ok, again not aimed at you barmy.
The definition of going out here is a little strained. As far as I understand, the parents were at a restaurant in the same complex as the room they were staying in, about 50 yards away from the residential complex. They hadn't abandoned the kids and gone clubbing. Had it been a standard hotel rather than a resort they would have been in a restaurant downstairs. They are parents on holiday with small children, maybe they needed some time off and felt it was safe. That is (obviously in light of the events that followed) very ill advised, but does it make them evil?
I'm not defending their actions, nor am I saying in any way that the media furore surrounding the case is right, but there's a lot of speculation based on very little evidence being made here. I understand that that is a facet of forums, and i don't want to censor everyone, these are just some points that I felt the need to respond to.
As for the case itself?
Yes I care that a little girl has, let's face facts here, probably been killed. Has it affected my life in any way? No. I'm not a parent, but i am an uncle and godfather, and if this happened to any kids that I actually knew I would be devastated. I don't know Maddy or her parents, so I find it hard to care past the first 3 days of the case.
If the parents are found guilty it adds more tragedy to the story, but also more for the media to get it's teeth into. The media is not evil, but it is like a slavering rottweiler that needs raw meat to feed it. In cases like this when the media has supported one side of the story and turns out to be wrong, it's like a dog turning on a cruel master and savaging them to death.
slark01
08-09-07, 03:59 PM
I'm simply fed up with all of it, the McCanns are the only ones that know whether they are guilty of anything.
The papers, forums, and generally the entire media are all talking out of their proverbials when it comes to so call FACTS!
A huge amount of information that is being handed out is hearsay and not solid factual evidence. The media cannot even get the forensics right!
So blah blah humbug to the media!!
Feel better now, thx :)
The definition of going out here is a little strained. As far as I understand, the parents were at a restaurant in the same complex as the room they were staying in, about 50 yards away from the residential complex. They hadn't abandoned the kids and gone clubbing. .
Yes that is as the crow flies. Their appartment to the reastraunt means walking out going onto the main road and then entering a diff complex to eat. If you saw the pic at the time there is a fu*k off 8ft wall betwen their room and the start of the complex.
The kids were not safe at all. access to the main road and hidden from view of the place the parents were eating.
its one thing to say its 50yrds, but another when you look at it and its a 300 yrd walk to get to them!!
anyway lets all just see what happens and what actual evidence there is against the parents before we all speculate.
If they are proven to have done it by hard evidence then i hope they have the death penalty in spain!!!
i just hope its resolved soon. if parents did kill maddy - why? Lets just hope other 2 kids are safe. I feel sorry for them being dumped in nursery etc while parents play with media. If you had lost one child would not not want other kids with you at all times?
SoulKiss
08-09-07, 04:31 PM
i just hope its resolved soon. if parents did kill maddy - why?
If the "they drugged her to get her to sleep so they could go out, and it went wrong" theory plays out to be true then its simple.
Both of the parents will lose their jobs/be struck off if it is discovered that they abused their child/children this way.
The only "hope" in that situation is to dump the body and try and make out that someone took her.
Funny thing is that I have thought about and cared more about this topic since this thread started than ever.
Mind you, mostly its because of this "the parents might be guilty angle" as I want to see the reactions of all the people/organisations that jumped on the bandwagon.
I do feel sorry for the poor child tho.
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