Going down with the ship... (Censorship in the UK)

[flymo]

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

.....they don't make hardly any money on CD's.
Make good music, every bugger downloads it.

Case in point. I bet if they had the option, they would make a crap load.

If I had the option I'd make a crap load too, neither of us have the option.

All hail communism.

[flymo]

Communism would work really well if it weren't for human nature.

[Fallout]

My sympathy for copyright holders and pirating is directly proportional to my perception of how much effort it takes to make. I can summarize it pretty easily:

1. Don't download movies
2. Don't download games
3. You can downlaod SOME software
4. Download any music you want

My opinions explained:

1. Movies cost a lot of money to make, take a long time and include significant financial risk from producers etc. A lot of people are involved, and actors have to make it their career. If actors and directors just worked behind bars and then went off for a few days to make movies now and then in their free time, the result would be horrific. Movies would be rubbish, and as such, the movie industry is a legitimate industry and stealing from them isn't right.

2. Games are the same as movies. They take many talented people who have to specialise full time, earn crap money and work themselves to the bone. Game development companies often go under because the profit margins are so low. Obviously companies making things like the Call of Duty franchise are raking it in, but overall it's an industry employing tens of thousands of people, who all work extremely hard for comparitively low wages, and stealing from them is not right.

3. Software theft I put under a different category, because there are some items of professional software which is so expensive normal people would NEVER buy it, because they simply can't afford to. Examples in game development are things like 3D Studio Max (£2000) and Maya (even more). There are lots of hobbyist game developers using 3DS Max who would never but use it anyway. I don't see the harm here, since the software developers market are professional companies who will buy licenses. Their market is not being diminished by hobbyists steeling their software, and if anything, it is increasing the user base and popularity of their software. I think this is OK.

4. I have no problems with people downloading any music. Why? Well, music takes talent to make (sometimes!) but the effort required is SIGNIFICANTLY lower. I mean, all good tunes have the hook written in a few hours, be it electronic music or real music. So many bands wrote their first albums at weekends while working in a bar to make ends meat. It's their passion and hobby, a leisure activity and they enjoy it, and it can easily be done in their spare time. It doesn't require financial investment apart from a few bits of kit they would've bought anyway for fun, and studio time can be bought for cheap for people to put albums together.

Yes, the Simon Cowells of this world throw millions into manufacturing bands and promoting them, but this isn't the core of music. This is a marketing business, using music as it's vessel. It's not real music.

If there was no money in music, music would live on. All the great bands you know would still have written albums, because they're passionate about it. They could still tour, because nobody can steel copies of tickets (well, you can, but not download them from the internet). All the manufactured pop music would die though, and all that would be left would be the good stuff.


So, I don't personally care about what the law dictates is morally right. I have my own set of morals, based on what I believe is right for me. The hard working movie producers, and the slave driven game developers get my support. The manufactured pop bands do not.

For the record, I don't download anything illegally. I'm not just saying that as a "I only do the speed limit" covering my ar$e statement. I genuinely don't, because I can't be bothered and I can listen to music on sites like YouTube.

[Fallout]

Edit: Double post!

[SoulKiss]

Originally Posted by flymo

Communism would work really well if it weren't for human nature.

+1 on this point.

If democracy is "one man, one vote", why are Dictatorships, with one man having one vote seen as a bad thing...

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by flymo

Case in point. I bet if they had the option, they would make a crap load.

Maybe some of those people had well paid jobs before and are now in music because they love it, not to get rich quick.

Would you rather have true artists who make enough to get by from gigs and T shirts, or c*nts like cowell (tm )

Originally Posted by flymo

Communism would work really well if it weren't for human nature.

So would representative democracy.


(N.B. as in the systemwe live under as oppose to absolute democracy the only exmple of which would have existed under communism is there had ever been a true communist state)

[flymo]

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

Maybe some of those people had well paid jobs before and are now in music because they love it, not to get rich quick.

Would you rather have true artists who make enough to get by from gigs and T shirts, or c*nts like cowell (tm )

I'm sure there all sorts of people involved, those looking to make a living and those that simply enjoy it. But the choice is theirs, I don't believe it's ours to decide for them.

'making enough to get by' is a subjective term. My intent might be to cruise along the med on my new yacht, paid for by my globally popular talent as a rock star (I wish). Or it might be to earn enough to pay the tax on my van. Who gets to decide?

Whoever pays your wages/you money usually gets to decide, even if they dont know it.