If you were to work in IT

Originally Posted by fizzwheel

I've got a BTEC National Diploma in Computer Studies and thats it.

I have the following job titles associated with my job role

Technical Support Analyst
Data Centre Manager
Windows Server Technical Design Authority

Bascailly I do support, data centre management and Infrastucture design. I have no formal qualification apart from my BTEC, I've learnt my stuff as I've gone along.

Qualifications on there own without the necessary skills and experience to back them up mean nothing.

My advice, get in somewhere on their helpdesk and start learning the trade and then work your way towards doing what you want to do.

MSCE and Cisco CCNA are all very nice, but I've met so many candidates with those qualifications and they have no real world skills.

See i done that Btec and found to be useless, maybe it was the people in my college class that didn't help, but it didn't really teach me anything I didn't know.

Yet im no systems engineer or analyst, of which is rather frustrating. Esp working in IT now for 8 years. I think it also has to do with my previous companies not giving a rats ass on development no matter how much I asked for help with my career....

Thats why I got out of london, and i've learnt more about more technical apps (nothing major yet) in 9 months than I did in 8 years in the city.

Difference was the city paid a LOT more than im on now....

Still, give it a few years, get my skills up to a proper level, then I can do what I want.

[fizzwheel]

Originally Posted by Daimo

See i done that Btec and found to be useless, maybe it was the people in my college class that didn't help, but it didn't really teach me anything I didn't know.

I taught me that college lecture's have no experience of how the real world works, but it got me on the ladder.

Our course had 6 weeks worth of work experience in it, which lead to me getting my first proper I.T. job when I left college which was working on a helpdesk, which then lead me on to where I am now...

Originally Posted by Daimo

CCNA is a good one to have

MCSE is common and isn't worth it imo.

Nothing comical about it? Least im trying

Both Dave & I did our CCNAs years back when you couldn't take a day or two off work, buy a copy of the exam and go and cheat at it. That has somewhat devalued the certs.

I use to have a CCNA but expired years ago. Other than that I have no formal qualifications in IT.

However, don't go into IT because its cool and you think you can earn a lot of money. Its not, and you can't (well not easily). I'm a geek, I work in IT. However its not as good as it sounds from the outside.

Job titles mean naff all, i've been everything from a sysadmin to lead engineer to network engineering consultant.

Find something that really interests you in IT and learn it well (networks, unix, security) , after you have a good basic knowledge of things like Linux, IP Networks (routing, switching), etc...

Dan

Originally Posted by Sudoxe

Both Dave & I did our CCNAs years back when you couldn't take a day or two off work, buy a copy of the exam and go and cheat at it. That has somewhat devalued the certs.

I use to have a CCNA but expired years ago. Other than that I have no formal qualifications in IT.

However, don't go into IT because its cool and you think you can earn a lot of money. Its not, and you can't (well not easily). I'm a geek, I work in IT. However its not as good as it sounds from the outside.

Job titles mean naff all, i've been everything from a sysadmin to lead engineer to network engineering consultant.

Find something that really interests you in IT and learn it well (networks, unix, security) , after you have a good basic knowledge of things like Linux, IP Networks (routing, switching), etc...

Dan

In the end of the day you will need an analytical mind and good problem solving skills. There are plenty of books out there that will get you started on the basics of networking, system administration and other things that IT departments do now a days. People skills do help if you are going into a customer facing role, mainly to stop you going on a murderous rampage after they change their mind or **** you off (happens, a lot).

[Skip]

I have an HND in Computer Studies which got me in the door at my last two jobs but it basically means nothing when it comes to knowledge. I did as most others have done and worked my time in the trenches on a helpdesk - I am now the IT manager (of a department of 1 - me!) at a 200 user/5 server company - its not exciting but it pays the mortgage so I am going to sit tight for now...

I've worked in IT for almost 6 years now. I've got top marks in 2 IT-related degrees. I've also done all the courses for OCP and MCDBA, but not taken the exams, due to political reasons at my old organisation. I've worked on hundreds of sites all over the UK and its islands, with literally thousands of different people. I've found a wide spectrum of attitudes from people ranging from:
Degrees are nothing- vocational qualifications are what actually show you can do the job.
to,
Degrees are timeless- they show you can apply problem solving and learn to a high level and unlike current vocational qualifications, these skills never date.
and even,
Qualifications are just a bits of paper and don't mean anything in the real world.

Generally speaking, the attitude seems related to the person's own qualifications, although you occassionally encounter someone without a degree who reveres traditional education far too highly; even if it's a 3rd class in an irrelevant, outdated course taught by chimpanzees at a useless, backwards university. My own attitude is somewhere between all three. I've encountered people with no qualifications at all who have been technically brilliant and I've also quite literally nearly wet myself trying not to laugh at someone senior to me who incessantly boasted about spending £9K of his own money on doing his OCP failing to start up a stopped instance. I'd say degrees (ironically, usually from more prestigious universities) are sometimes not related to contemporary, never mind future, technologies and are taught by people who've never actually worked in IT. I'd also say that too many vocational qualifications are structured in a way that allow you to learn the answers to the test without really understanding the underlying principles (the same way most people pass the driving theory test). Irrespective of my views though, vocational qualifications and related degrees will pay for themselves many times over, over the course of your career. They will also get you into an organisation higher up and doing more interesting work sooner than having to work from the bottom up and I'd recommend doing them for these reasons alone.

Job titles don't mean that much: "Technical Consultant" can mean everything between "untrained call centre phone monkey" through to "guru deep into six figure salary, who works all over the world on a garagantuan day rate". Likewise "Network engineer" can mean a work experience level kid who just physically plugs cables into network cards and doesn't even know what the OSI model is, much less understand it, through to someone who can do absolutely everything that is even tangentally related to networking all sorts of devices.

I'm a Business Systems Analyst and have no related qualifications. Yet I don't know how many times I have run through the whole SDLC, producing solutions for numerous different business units, not to mention running/leading system implementations... including ERP's and WMS systems.

I think the only time qual's are taken into account are at interview.

Get a job in Schools IT Tech Support, you'll probably get a job with no qualifications... I did, then just let your employers pay for all the courses you tell them you MUST go on.

Steve

Thanks the replies, some of them which are detail, I'll explian my motives.....

I was talking with my sister who works in IT sales, about okay so I need a new job. I was thinking well selling stuff can't be that hard can it? We both aggredd I am techie and much better at that.

I am a techincal person, I used pull things apart just see how they worked, I broek a few a few own computers just lets say my dad wasn't impressed sometimes. But with all that trial and error I magae to teach my self how to program in dos. Then use windows ect, put computers togther ect as a teenager. When I was runner, I used to fix everyones computers as no one else knew what the hell was going on ect.

I have a techicnal HND, then a BA (Hons) degree after that, I'm intelligent and teach myself things, I just want something to apply myself too.

This looks a good chance and a descent job and carrer, which I can make something out of.

I was looking at these web sites and compines, that will train you up and find you working, stating that they will get a job at around 30k or so, looks good but how true is it?

I didn't go oh thats look execting, and glam lets do that. I have done quite a few of those jobs, that other people say "oh that must be execting" so I know they aren't. As for money I'm looking to make what I do now, then move up through the ranks to make more. Lets be honest who doesn't want to make a good amount of money?

Originally Posted by Bluethunder

I was looking at these web sites and compines, that will train you up and find you working, stating that they will get a job at around 30k or so, looks good but how true is it?

No they wont, its all BS, you'll make more money (or bottles of booze) fixing your families & neighbors PC's!

Steve