IT Careers advice please

[fizzwheel]

Originally Posted by Spiderman

Helpdesks tho, really? Do i have to?

Seriously its one of the most rewarding jobs I've ever done, but its also the most frustrating... We're not all morons. I met alot of very good, capable, skilled and intensley likeable people. Most of which I'm still friends with 20 years later.

I've only met a few wally's and I helped most of them out of the door... Its very competative at times and often you'll be flying by the seat of your pants especially when somethings broken and you dont know how to fix it and the hottie in HR cant print out her reports

IMHO helpdesk isnt about IT skills, its more about people skills, how you talk to people and making them understand complicated stuff without confusing the hell out of them.

If you can show some comon sense, work under pressure and use your intiative and you're a quick learner you wont be on the helpdesk for very long trust me.

I work in IT too, and there's some good tips here. I think the best routes in without formal quals or specific IT experience are as people have said - helpdesk or IT sales.

[SoulKiss]

Originally Posted by Spiderman

thanks guys

Many years a go i remember a few friends were doing the MCSE course, stying from home mainly. Only one of them got a job in IT and thats because he decided to set up on his own at a young age and lving at home and having vitrually no outgoig meant he could undercut most of the competiton, lol. So he got work. I dont think he ever got rich from it but it was his own thing an he was happy.

I dont mind a job that pays a wage, as some of you see it but prefer Fizz'z attitude of seeing at as always challenging and always new. Like i said above the few small IT things i've done for work have always seemed interesting and i get a kck out of making he damn thing work, lol. After about 1000 goes at it sometimes.

Helpdesks tho, really? Do i have to? Some of the muppets i have spoken to when i've been forced to call helpdesks have known less than i know (and i dont know much as i say) have been less than helpfull. Do i really have to be amongst those brainless zombies to get a foot in the door?
I'm a smart, articulate guy you know.

I also see IT as having more options than the sales ive always done. As the old saing goes "You're only as good as your last sale" and i'm getting very sick of the constant effort it takes to maintain that.

Fizz i may well drop you a PM later dude, meanwhile if anyone has any other advice please pop it in here...or if you're a nice person who can offer me a helpdesk job with nice-ish people then thats even better

Of course you can always chat to me on Friday night too.

.

Originally Posted by timwilky

Coding is easy, you need a methodical approach to problem analysis and logical thought processes.

Coding is only good if you understand and know the code your writing off by heart. If you have something to explain in a way YOU understand the code, and have done a few years learning it all, yeah, sure, well easy........

I've been trying to learn xhtml and css for 3 years on and off by myself and have got absolutly no-where because I have trouble learning by myself, and loose interest because I cannot grasp it. Whats the point in "knowing" code if you don't understand the principles? Or even the other way round, you understand the principles, but can't get your head around the amount of code?

Fizz, you ENJOY'D your helpdesk job? My word I hated it, and still do hate having to answer the phone every time it rings, although this role has more server work, but im no techhy.

Tbh, i seemed to have drifted from company to company, never happy. Never being one for "playing the office game", and even though my morals and ethics are very high, and my work rate has always been at the top of the charts, i've never got anywhere.

I've found that if you have your own mind, and are prepared to stand up for what you believe is right, you are a troublemaker. No matter how good a worker you are, how much work you go through, how many "so called" friends and work colleague you get on with, theres always some ass kissing tw4t who does bugger all work, yet has their head so far up a managers ass they'll get every promotion under the sun.

Maybe its me? My attitude? Prehapes, but then not being an ass kisser, working hard all the time, ensuring you speak to your clients in a proffessional helpful assertive manner, doing overtime for nothing, coming into work whilst londons being bus bombed, etc, is bad work ethics, so don't follow my rules.

Just sit back, kiss the managers ass, u'll go far.........


My god I hate working in IT I really don't think I should be in it.

[fizzwheel]

Originally Posted by Daimo

Fizz, you ENJOY'D your helpdesk job? My word I hated it, and still do hate having to answer the phone every time it rings, although this role has more server work, but im no techhy.

No not all the time. But then mine was strictly desk bound. If I picked up the phone to somebody who had a problem and I couldnt fix it over the phone I had enough freedom with in the job roll to get up from my desk and go and find them and talk to them face to face / sit at their PC and sort it out that way which did break up the monotany of it and I got to meet alot of people.

Like I said it can be frustrating, but I also found it rewarding and it was nice when people appreciated my efforts and said thank you.

Its also a great way to meet single young ladies especially when one of your core customer bases is a 350 seat call centre

Originally Posted by Daimo

I've found that if you have your own mind, and are prepared to stand up for what you believe is right, you are a troublemaker. No matter how good a worker you are.

My role is different now, I'm paid to look at things and then come up with solutions to problems. Like I said to my boss ages ago. "You dont pay my wages to not listen to what I have to say" Its my job to speak up and roll up my sleves when the sh*te hits the fan, and then I also have enough clout now to make sure it doesnt happen again, if that means being honest and speaking up and telling the truth that is what I do.

I tend to say well if we dont do x,y,z then a, b or c is going to happen, if I get ignored its great because then I get to say "I told you so", its happened enough times where I've been ignored and stuff has gone wrong that now I dont get ignored anymore...

[Spiderman]

Thanks guys this is all very helpfull. Been looking at IT sales as a way in but they all seem to want you to know the IT products in question to get in, ie Print Colour Managment IT Sales....you must have prior print colour knowledge I sold property for 15yrs so its mainly property focused, tho for the last 5yrs i designed and sold bathrooms and kitchens and i learnt all that from scratch on the job.

But none of these things seem to matter, lol.

The other issue (not to me but employers) si that i'm comming into this much older than everyone else. I'm not an old git by any means, i'm only 37 (i know i look 28 ) but some of you seem to have worked on helpdesks etc 20yrs ago (did we have computers that neede helpdesks back then? I thought we all used abacuses, lol) so i need an emplyer who sees my knowledge base as an asset, not my age as a hinderance. Or is it so not like that for IT helpdesks?

I love doing helpdesk work, it's not really my job but I often spend time in helpdesk working. The majority of it is quite thankless but can be rewarding when you solve an issue or help someone who is really upset etc.

Helpdesk used to be a better job years ago, when it was more of a face to face role, nowdays the majority of helpdesk tasks can be completed remotely.

IT salaries have taken a bit of a hit, but if you are trying to get into it and are prepared to start on the bottom rung with a salary to match, you may find something.

Speak to Viney too, he runs printrooms, which can be quite an interesting role. I believe the company he works for are often looking for pre-sales people too.

There are a couple of IT salespeople on here too, who may be able to point you in the right direction.

Don't go down the MCSE route, it is a waste of time. If I look at a CV with that on it, it holds no more weight than a GCSE in History or PE, with regard to a day to day Helpdesk role.

If you really must get a course, go down the Cisco route or possibly learn HP Procurve stuff.

There are a few linux guru's on here, their work is proper hardcore and if you can get your head round that there is always going to be work around. I have tried to get some of them to do some work for me but they don't want to.

Originally Posted by fizzwheel

No not all the time. But then mine was strictly desk bound. If I picked up the phone to somebody who had a problem and I couldnt fix it over the phone I had enough freedom with in the job roll to get up from my desk and go and find them and talk to them face to face / sit at their PC and sort it out that way which did break up the monotany of it and I got to meet alot of people.

Like I said it can be frustrating, but I also found it rewarding and it was nice when people appreciated my efforts and said thank you.

Its also a great way to meet single young ladies especially when one of your core customer bases is a 350 seat call centre



My role is different now, I'm paid to look at things and then come up with solutions to problems. Like I said to my boss ages ago. "You dont pay my wages to not listen to what I have to say" Its my job to speak up and roll up my sleves when the sh*te hits the fan, and then I also have enough clout now to make sure it doesnt happen again, if that means being honest and speaking up and telling the truth that is what I do.

I tend to say well if we dont do x,y,z then a, b or c is going to happen, if I get ignored its great because then I get to say "I told you so", its happened enough times where I've been ignored and stuff has gone wrong that now I dont get ignored anymore...

I have been both desk bound, and customer facing bound. This role requires both as we have 8 sites, so your remoting on whilst speaking. I get to drive out to the sites every so often which really breaks up the days sometimes.

I've just had bad luck. At my old place if your face didn't fit.... I'd been top of the call resolutions for about 5 months in a row. We had issues with assets physically going missing, and THE best solution at the time was barcoding. I really tried to push this, but the managers (who wasn't keen on me) said no no no.... So they hire an asset manager, and guess what they suggested.... 1 year later, its rolled out. I've got quite a few of these instances though, hence why I left after being shafted for 4 years.

Other roles just mean I didn't get on with the people. Some people were great, made my day good fun, but those that didn't hit me hard, and just as im finding with my so called "family company", its all take take take and never give anything back to the employee's. Its disgracefull it really is.

I try to promote a healthy IT image. Everyone hates IT, always moaning its not working etc. We rolled out (of which even though I tried and tried to get into, i've been left out, im IT and i've had absolutly no training on the new software, which is good, as i don't have to support it). Anyway, everyones moaning, I promote it, "it'll be hard work for a little while, but it will make your life much easier, its just change, and change requires a little input and the attitude of its going to work, not its going to be rubbish" etc... Doesn't do me any favours bar looks of "your f*king stupid or mad"....


Spider, don't "listen" to me, but take it on board as well. If you go to a larger company, your a number in IT, not an employee. Your also an expense, and expendable. I've had directors who love IT, and those who hate IT, and even though its one of the most important factors in a business these days, the staff that run it, no matter how long the service, are still suseptable to outsourcing, and being given the chop when budgets kick in.

If i've learnt something in 10 years, its look after yourself, cos no other f*cker will help you out, even if you go to a big company director with a 2 page report on what your good at, what your bad at, what you enjoy and dislike, how you want to learn but need some help and guidence.... It gets you no-where.... (this particular director even had the cheek to have a huge go at me becuase I didn't attend a meeting i'd be "pushing" for, conterary to the fact i'd been knocked off my motorcycle and couldn't even walk, and then I STILL came to work hobbling, even though i'd been signed off (i didn't know your not allowed to come in), because I could still use my hands, and in my upbringing, that meant I could work, so I went in......).

Other advice, go small, get into a smaller company, more hands on, more training, more social, friendlier, your an employee, not a number... Just don't come here

Or Simmons and Simmons
Or Goldman Sachs
Or Taylor Wessing
Or Teach Stern Selby
Or Sinclair Roach and Temperly, oh, actually, thats folded..... the only one I actually enjoyed I got made redundent from


Actually, just stay away from Law Firms and Banks. Great totty though, that made the days go by sometimes

[SoulKiss]

Originally Posted by krhall

I love doing helpdesk work, it's not really my job but I often spend time in helpdesk working. The majority of it is quite thankless but can be rewarding when you solve an issue or help someone who is really upset etc.

Helpdesk used to be a better job years ago, when it was more of a face to face role, nowdays the majority of helpdesk tasks can be completed remotely.

IT salaries have taken a bit of a hit, but if you are trying to get into it and are prepared to start on the bottom rung with a salary to match, you may find something.

Speak to Viney too, he runs printrooms, which can be quite an interesting role. I believe the company he works for are often looking for pre-sales people too.

There are a couple of IT salespeople on here too, who may be able to point you in the right direction.

Don't go down the MCSE route, it is a waste of time. If I look at a CV with that on it, it holds no more weight than a GCSE in History or PE, with regard to a day to day Helpdesk role.

If you really must get a course, go down the Cisco route or possibly learn HP Procurve stuff.

There are a few linux guru's on here, their work is proper hardcore and if you can get your head round that there is always going to be work around. I have tried to get some of them to do some work for me but they don't want to.

I too like the some of the Helldesk stuff - I used to be the last port of call - when an issue had been going on and on, with no resolution happening it would get dumped on me and I'd fix it - more because of people skills than technical in many cases, so your sales experience IS good experience, you have to sell the fact that YOU are going to get the persons problem resolved, then get them to buy into the concept that this works best if they will assist you, then finally check that they are happy with the end result, I once took a VERY annoyed customer (the issue had been ongoing for about 2 months before it got to me) and sorted it all out in a day or so, a lot of that being "wasted" on convincing him that the best course of action was for me to treat this like a brand new case and look at it from 1st principles, even though it would mean him re-doing things he had already been asked to do.

If you can talk the customer through the fix and make them feel like they are learning something (and if its something that stops them calling the helldesk again so much the better) then they end up going away feeling really good about what they have learned.

The key skill is to never have Teflon Coated Slopey Shoulders, never try and dodge the rubbish calls (I have seen this SOOOO many times) and always be positive - your Boss will probably have been on the Helldesk at some point and KNOWS its a rubbish job, but with the right attitude you can get out of there petty quick, when something comes up that needs escalating to a more technical team, try and follow the problem, go to the guys that fix it and find out how - you can sell this as being able to reduce their workload next time that issue comes up.

Cisco qualifications are now going the way of MCSE's especially the lower end ones - with the availability of simulators etc there are actuall CCNA qualified people who have bever touched a piece of proper Cisco kit.

As for Linux, well you REALLY need to have an interest in it, its not something that you can just learn, you have to live it - and the reason I never took Kev up on the offer is that as I already have a Job, I cannot support anything that that I did for him in a real-time 24/7 situation.

In saying that, installing it on an old PC and learning how it works to the same extent as how you know Windows works, would not be a bad thing these days.

I actually think that Spidey COULD make a good Helldesk guy, good enough to get out of there and into something like pre-sales easily.