Legal / law advice needed!

[Biker Biggles]

Were you serious about tenant 1 having gone back to Nigeria?I would suggest you take out a small claims case against them,but if they are Nigerian I fear you cant and you have been scammed.

[Red Herring]

Such a shame that this particular Nigerian appears to have defrauded the OP. It could give his fellow countrymen a bad name. If that were to happen I imagine it would be difficult for them to be trusted by their housemates to take care of the bills.

[ophic]

Originally Posted by SvNewbie

My advice would be don't speak to the debt collectors (ideally don't even admit its you). No good can come of it, they just try to convince you to 'pay right now over the phone'. Speak to the company over the phone, ideally get someone useful's direct extension or full name and ask for them when you call the call centre.

I'm in a dispute with British Gas at the moment, because they're incompetent and can't send me the right bill. Anyway I just thought I'd speak up in defence of the debt collectors they use who have all been thoroughly pleasant and professional and available out of office hours etc. At least so far. I reserve the right to withdraw this statement.

[Sir Trev]

Student houses and bills - shudder - I still remember those days. For all the hassle it's going to cause you in getting the money back I'm sorry to say it may be easier to pay it and chase him separately. I know you said it's not a great option due to your fiscal situation but life is short and if the debt mounts and the bailiffs get involved it will hurt your credit rating. The battle to get a deposit back from a landlord got too much for my housemates and we just had to walk away, gutting as it was, knowing full well the barsteward was doing it to every one of his tenants, so I know it hurts.

Allan, get hold of the original agreement and scrutinise it. If your names are all on the utility agreement then speak to the utility company and make an offer to cover your quarter. Send them a copy of the tenancy as proof that you had four tenants in the property.

If your name is not on the utility agreement (and someone else's is) then give them the advice above and count your lucky stars because you're not legally liable to the utility company (or debt collectors).

If the tenancy agreement says you're jointly responsible for all bills then negotiate with the utility company.

In all cases of negotiating or making offers, use recorded post, keep a copy of all correspondence, send a cheque with your proportion of the settlement and advise that if said cheque was cash, this would be treated as full and final settlement of your liability in this matter.

As for tenant 1, only Karma will get them as British civil debts are unenforceable in Nigeria as far as I'm aware. There is really nothing you can do if they're out of the country. This is why its important for the landlord to retain the deposits upon proof of satisfying all utilities. Yours failed to do that and this is the result.

Which is also a good point for anyone in a similar situation. If you know you're going to move out, don't put money in the joint account to split the bill. Use the deposit as a means to settle up and then only add the difference if the deposit doesn't cover the full contribution.

Runako - The point about paying by cheque and saying if cashed it is acceptance of full and final isn't actually legally enforceable. The only time it is, is if it comes from a third party. (It's too do with having a valid contract).

There have been times that companies have cashed cheques and still requested payment of the full amount.

I think the common theme is, try and negotiate with the utility providers to reduce your liability as much as possible.

Originally Posted by EssexDave

Runako - The point about paying by cheque and saying if cashed it is acceptance of full and final isn't actually legally enforceable. The only time it is, is if it comes from a third party. (It's too do with having a valid contract).

There have been times that companies have cashed cheques and still requested payment of the full amount.

I think the common theme is, try and negotiate with the utility providers to reduce your liability as much as possible.

Dave, a utility agreement is a legally enforceable contract.

In attempting to settle any debt you can propose terms. This is simply a form of negotiation, but the terms dictate that cheque should not be cashed if the offer of settlement is not agreed. This is no different from any other settlement terms, but the method is unilateral and places the onus to accept on the creditor.

There is case law... but I tried provide a most practical - not technical - solution to the problem. And I don't really wish to bore everyone with the rules and exceptions.

Allan. This strategy works. It will simply be far more cost effective to recover some of the debt in comparison to the cost of pursuing all the parties via civil proceedings when there is little prospect of payment (one debtor in Nigeria, the other in Spain, another in Rome). I could also advise you on the likely outcome if you choose to ignore it but this is another lengthy post which is not necessary if my proposed strategy is successful.

Either follow this advice, or seek professional legal advice. You have three choices here Allan. Contact the Citizens Advice Bureau - http://www.citizensadvice.org.uk, your local trading standards (nearest to your home) - http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/advice/index.cfm, or pay for the advice.

Cease all negotiations, get a lawyer ASAP.

Between communications you might admit to greater liability than you had to begin with, not only will they have lawyers but they can also ask you of things that you've no legal requirement to fulfill, without a lawyer you'll be none the wiser.

Originally Posted by LiquidFlux

Cease all negotiations, get a lawyer ASAP.

Between communications you might admit to greater liability than you had to begin with, not only will they have lawyers but they can also ask you of things that you've no legal requirement to fulfill, without a lawyer you'll be none the wiser.

Haven't you been paying attention? The advice given so far IS to impart wisdom. Also, as I pointed out, a "lawyer" isn't the only available option. It will obviously cost to be advised by a solicitor whereas there are legal experts in other organisations who will advise and advocate for free. Also, my advice is worth money.

[keith_d]

One last thought. When you discuss it with them make sure they know you now live in Rome. For most debt collectors it's not worth the trouble to chase foreign residents for payment.