gatso B******s!

[Biker Biggles]

Overcome the truth maybe but justice?Unless you are one of the "zero tolerance" zealots who believe that every misdemeanour must be ruthlessly punished and taken on the chin like a man come what may,there is an arguement for common sense to be had here.The problem with "techno enforcement"is that there is no room for common sense,and that is why it is becoming increasingly unpopular as more people get ensnared by it.

Originally Posted by SoulKiss

I was looking at the arguement of it not being safe to stop - temporary bad road surface due to diesel etc - embelish with a locked wheel/slide that took you over the lines - based on whether the photos show that or not....

That may be a valid excuse if the poor road surface had been reported by the OP on the day - I don't suppose there are many excuses that haven't been tried yet.

[Red Herring]

Originally Posted by Biker Biggles

Overcome the truth maybe but justice?Unless you are one of the "zero tolerance" zealots who believe that every misdemeanour must be ruthlessly punished and taken on the chin like a man come what may,there is an arguement for common sense to be had here.The problem with "techno enforcement"is that there is no room for common sense,and that is why it is becoming increasingly unpopular as more people get ensnared by it.

Fair point, hence my comment about questioning such prosecutions. I'm no zealot, I hate automatic enforcement and am definately in Blue Pete's camp that coppers should do the business, not number crunching clerks hidden away in offices, but I do believe that if after all your questions and research the facts are you did it....then don't try and lie your way out of it.

[Biker Biggles]

Id like to see these automatic three points and a £60 fine banned,and all cases heard by magistrates,who should be given discretion.Then you would not get the blackmail of "pay up and shut up"or get a bigger fine in court,as happens now.I cant help feeling that magistrates would soon start to question the endless nitpicking against otherwise law abiding citizens that is a product of "zero tolerance".
Of course it would cost money,thus defeating the revenue raising principle behind the current system.A classic example would be the camera outside a school,where someone going a bit quicker on a deserted Sunday morning might get treated differently from a similar "offense"at school going home time.No chance of it happening though.

[SoulKiss]

Originally Posted by Red Herring

Yeah right, nothing like a blatant lie to try and overcome the truth and justice. You may not like camera enforcement, lets face it, you would be in a minority if you did, but lets keep things in perspective here. By all means examine the evidence, question the accuracy and operation, and even argue over the merits of such prosecutions, but lets at least have the dignity to face up to our mistakes and take it on the chin if you broke the law. Hiding behind a lie is just pathetic.

Nice one.

Of course what I should have added is that if his license is otherwise clean its probably not worth it, as 3 points wont affect him that much.

But if he's on 9....

Also I dont see why, when so many cyclists run them, we should just lie down and take it.

[Red Herring]

Getting up to 9 is a tad careless I'd say.....although I guess if you do the same trip every day past the same camera there is bound to be the moment when you forget. Happened to me once, I changed my route home!

Couldn't agree more on cyclists, was in London over the weekend and it's just unbelievable, but I think we've had this discussion before.....

[TEC]

Originally Posted by Red Herring

.... By all means examine the evidence,........ but lets at least have the dignity to face up to our mistakes...

If the evidence proves guilt then I agree but that was why I posted what I did. Dappa may well have run an amber and a following vehicle ran the red setting off the camera but still catching enough of Dappa's plate for them send out a ticket

Originally Posted by Red Herring

Getting up to 9 is a tad careless I'd say.....although I guess if you do the same trip every day past the same camera there is bound to be the moment when you forget. Happened to me once, I changed my route home!

Couldn't agree more on cyclists, was in London over the weekend and it's just unbelievable, but I think we've had this discussion before.....

right a few things...i know no-ones being argumentative and its a good debate...however...

with these 3 points it will put me on 9 points....careless you may say, however lets examine why I have the initial 6 points......I passed my car test in 1999......6 days after passing I went to italy and worked for 13 months at age 18....i returned and got a job with a company car which i drove for 2yrs on the company insurance, i then had my own business for 2 yrs and had business rented cars on my own license (yes i had my license - both parts)...i then sold my comapany and went to work in ayia napa cyprus for a number of years...whilst there i lost my card license and my paper license...very long story but i was diagnosed with bipolar affective disorder and had a manic episode and had i had been in england i would have been sectioned......i lost everything i owned / all my money (few grand) and got locked up for a 2 weeks and then put in a secure hospital untill my parents came and got me.

last year after returning and having a clean bill of health i was insured on my patners car and was pulled in as a routine thing by police..i explained that i was waiting for my license to come as i had lost my old one...

at which point i was told i dont have a license and my insurance is not valid....got 6 points.....

dvla say that i never sent them the pass certificate after initially passing my test so no licens was ever issued which is bull**** as id had it for years and had been using it....but as usual law abiding citizen gets shafted because of departmental **** ups.....

i said in a previous post in this thread if im in the wrong ill accept liability and hold my hands up.....so no argument there...i am not "pathetic"....or a "liar"...the way i have been previously treated by the dvla is pathetic and unjust.

my mrs has called whilst ive been writing this essay and said the pic has arrived...so ill shall post shortly.....

[yorkie_chris]

The "taking it on the chin" thing completely confuses me.

If I was in a pub, and somebody wanted to hit me, I would duck, dodge, hit back etc etc.

Just because it's some desk weenie trying to hit you, doesn't mean you should bend over for it. Especially if there's any way out of it.

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

The "taking it on the chin" thing completely confuses me.

If I was in a pub, and somebody wanted to hit me, I would duck, dodge, hit back etc etc.

Just because it's some desk weenie trying to hit you, doesn't mean you should bend over for it. Especially if there's any way out of it.

nice one yc!!! good example!!!