Student protests in Westminster LIVE right now!

[Sid Squid]

Originally Posted by 454697819

but has a valid point.

Has it?

I don't think so. Education in this country is free, if you want further education so that you can enhance your earnings I don't see why people earning minimum wage should have their taxes spent on making you better off.

We've had about four decades of spending on something that should never have been - so much and so long has this been spent that the assumption it's right and normal is ingrained in the conciousness of those who wish to access education of all social and economic backgrounds.
This has never been correct, and now our economy has been wrested from the hands of those who should never have been entrusted with it some difficult economic decisions need to be made.

But still the purple faced raging child squeals.

[Biker Biggles]

I think it is a valid point,as is yours.The education system(at all levels)is not just there for individuals to get qualified and earn more money,although that is a significant part of it.It is also there for the betterment of our whole society and its economic progress.Witness the developing nations like India and China who are pulling out all the stops to get people educated to fuel their economies.Fail to keep up with that and our economic decline will accelerate dramatically making the last thirty years of decline look pedestrian.What we really need to do is find a way of getting the best people we have onto the best education courses and supporting them to do the best for the country.Jacking up fees wont achieve that IMO,it will just put off the talented and preserve the privilaged mediocrity we are so used to.

I read today that the students said they were harassed by the police with bars of soap and job adverts
Anon

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by Quedos

I was lucky i was tuition free but I believe that students should have to pay something as it will cleanse the courses of those who are only there for a good time.

I can't really see this at all.

I could not have afforded to pay the tuition fees and eat, I managed to scrape enough together scratting round under sh*tbox motors for 3/5ths of f*** all an hour in the snow and minging weather to buy myself a half decent bike at the end of the first year.
Lots of others end up with overdrafts at the end of each year due to living costs (not all of it alcoholic!)

Pay for it with what? At the moment if they just increase fees and student loans take up the slack then it won't change a thing as the student loan is very much the "never never".

If it needs paying for directly, people at 18 straight out of 6th form can't do it, no way. It would just limit places to the ones going on Daddy's credit card, and that isn't right.


I don't know what the solution is but more debt is not the key. I do think uni places need to be cut back. And hopefully from this the value of higher education would be increased.

[Sid Squid]

Originally Posted by Biker Biggles

Witness the developing nations like India and China who are pulling out all the stops to get people educated to fuel their economies.

Point taken but the two countries you mention are not a good example, they have a far smaller proportion of their populations that have a further education, and are extremely unlikely ever to even try to fund FE to the level that the UK enjoys. Much further education in this country has become at best esoteric, and at worst a simple unthinking extension of time in education for little value to either the recipient or our society, for some in FE it's become little more than 'just what you do'.

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

I do think uni places need to be cut back. And hopefully from this the value of higher education would be increased.

This is an excellent point - every extra body in your lectures is a dilution of the education you receive, if they're not serious about taking in and subsequently using that education more so.

The argument over debt is stratospherically overstated - you don't pay it back until you earn enough to do so, and you'll never get money from anywhere else at the sort of terms you'll get a student loan for.

[yorkie_chris]

Originally Posted by Sid Squid

The argument over debt is stratospherically overstated - you don't pay it back until you earn enough to do so, and you'll never get money from anywhere else at the sort of terms you'll get a student loan for.

Cheapest money you'll ever borrow.

And ideally it gets paid back a hell of a lot more times over than once due to the higher tax on higher earnings.
Which Mr Daily Mail "they're taking my tax money" seems to completely miss...


There was some damn commie from down saaaf "representing" students on the radio today... where did they dredge that bint up from, dear me she didn't help matters...

I have spoken to a person who was at the protest, out of 50 000 people he said it was about 200 or so people that actually casued all that damage isn't that the case when this kind of thing happens?

I think again another protest with a serious message is being lost in violence, there is no excuse for violence change can be achived without it.

What is fact is that to get the student vote Nick Clegg said he would stop the rise in fees for education, he signed a document saying this. Now he has gone back on his word. How can we trust another thing he says?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-11732787

It is right that is looked at, but isn't education going to be come something only the rich can do? Sounds like we going backwards rather than fowards...

With this whole spending review, its people that can least afford it it affects this dosen't affect MP's and their familes nor their peers just regular people.

There doesn't seem to an easy answer to this problem and many others we are facing, or we have the answer but just don't want to say it out loud.

[yorkie_chris]

The liberals have gone after the student vote in a big way for a few years, they've shot themselves in the foot good and proper IMO.

The only thing of note that was said by that commie bint was that students since the 90s or so have had a reputation as being "apolitical" and "apathetic" while actually a lot have attended marches and protests... just their peaceful nature has meant they didn't get heard. Now there has been a bit of violence the protest gets noticed...

Originally Posted by yorkie_chris

The liberals have gone after the student vote in a big way for a few years, they've shot themselves in the foot good and proper IMO.

The only thing of note that was said by that commie bint was that students since the 90s or so have had a reputation as being "apolitical" and "apathetic" while actually a lot have attended marches and protests... just their peaceful nature has meant they didn't get heard. Now there has been a bit of violence the protest gets noticed...

Yes they have question being where will that vote go now?

I went to several protest as a student, all of which were peaceful. Is not about about time, we actually had people in government who should be there not the puppets put in place to wave and smile.

[MisterTommyH]

Originally Posted by metalmonkey

I have spoken to a person who was at the protest, out of 50 000 people he said it was about 200 or so people that actually casued all that damage isn't that the case when this kind of thing happens?

Maybe, but when one if the student organisers goes on tele next day and says words to the effect of "yeah we had always been planning this kind of thing" I have no sympathy for any of them.

On another point do the police ever get a break? They get slated for not being prepared, but when they were prepared and 'kettled' people a few years ago they were apparently OTT.