Racism in the UK in 2011 [Archive] - Page 3 - SV650.org

northwind

15-02-11, 10:03 PM

Northwind sir, you must live in some kind of utopia, so it's ok to say it's black history month etc but if every other month is White history month can we call it that? I don't think so do you ?

Btw, the Hr guy from my previous company wasn't a liar, if he was 'quietly' requested to employ a % of ethnics then that's what happened MO.

If some PC **** who worked with Investors In People said that, then he should have said "Bite me". It does happen of course, there are idiots everywhere but the thing to do when faced with an idiot is to ignore them or better yet, burn them down.

(but, I will say one thing, it's a very good idea for companies to employ different backgrounds, you get different perspectives and ideas, and Investors in People would likely suggest that. This is good advice and within their remit but doesn't mean "You must employ efnics". Also it's much easier to cover christmas holidays and the likes if you get in a few people who want time off for Ramadan or whatever instead)

As for history, think about it, at school how much black history did you learn? The only time a black face appeared in my history books was because we went off somewhere and invaded it or "discovered" it or colonised it.

What you call it doesn't matter. When you say "black music" the audience knows what it is, job done. Are you so PC that you're afraid to admit there's some styles of music that are dominated by some ethnic groups and appeal to those ethnic groups? Just exactly like radio 1 is white english dominated, british history is white dominated...

There's no need to call it "white history 11 months" because everyone knows exactly what it is and because black history is such an exception. If we had better coverage all year round we wouldn't need black history month. If music awards had been less biased there'd be no MOBO. If police forces represented the people that lived in their areas there'd be no need to push to recruit minority officers.

Am I black? Couldn't be more the opposite mate, I'm sporting a healthy white glow for my scottish winter tan.

dizzyblonde

15-02-11, 10:06 PM

Go to east London, or Birmingham and try to enrol a White child in a black/Asian run school, I assure you he/she wouldn't get in or if he/she did, she wouldnt stay long, thus proving that mixing cultures does not work.

Here in Hx, we do have primary school that within the last ten years has turned from a predominantly white school, to a predominantly asian school. Its a game of spot the white kid when they come out at the end of day. People who are not Asian, do not like to send their children there. They seem to have some sort of phobia.

I should imagine its quite difficult to be a minority white child in what would be around a 1 in 20 ratio.

Suppose its different when the boots ont other foot!

However, the secondary school round the corner is the same, but with a slightly higher percentage of white children attending, they don't seem to be too bothered about mixing in with their asian friends. I'm assuming this, because they all hang around here at lunchtime, and pass on their way home from school.

Edit...come to think about it, theres not just Warley Rd thats a predominantly Asian Primary school, theres actually around 3 or four off the top of my head.

northwind

15-02-11, 10:06 PM

Now that you ask however, yes, they are different, I don't think there are all white schools who would actively block the application of a black pupil to enroll.

Really? You're that naive?

Stuuk1

15-02-11, 10:07 PM

I faced a lot of racism as a kid, and although its stopped now Im older, my son is 5 and he has already experienced it at school.

I will try my best to guide him, and to help him come to accept this will happen, and how to deal with it but I really do feel for him. I had no one to guide me with this particular issue as a child and I dealt with it in the only way I knew how - aggression.

I don't want that for my son, or my daughter.

I do genuinely feel for your son, and obviously yourself when you were a child, but I cannot see how it will ever change, only get worse.

The government try to make Britain multi-cultural but it can never work.

Stuuk1

15-02-11, 10:09 PM

Where in Solihull, cos 90% of it is pretty affluent, so much in fact it was high on the list of most affluent areas for the last few years.

Solihull is actually very nice area, huge houses with porsches everywhere, heading further in YO birminghmam is terrible.

Sorry, my mistake.

northwind

15-02-11, 10:10 PM

The government try to make Britain multi-cultural but it can never work.

Exactly the sort of thing people said when they started giving irresponsible silly women the vote. Britain already is multicultural, we're talking about it in this thread, just look around you. What won't work is trying to pretend we're all the same and that's where PC falls on its ****.

-Ralph-

15-02-11, 10:15 PM

Really? You're that naive?

I'm not naive enough to think there aren't individual heads who would put obstacles in the way, but if it went into the hands of the LEA then there would need to be a real reason why the child couldn't attend.

Just chatting with my Aunt on Facebook. My Uncle has been the head of various LEA's and is now semi-retired and travels round the UK advising LEA's on policy and curriculum. My wife is a teacher. I'd say they were anything but naive on the subject. Both think it would be very unlikely for blocking tactics to be continued if escalated to the LEA.

Private schools may be a different story, but there are all state schools in Brum that are "black only", not by policy, but in reality.

northwind

15-02-11, 10:16 PM

there are all black state schools in Brum that are "black only", not by policy, but in reality.

So just the same as all-white schools then.

Stuuk1

15-02-11, 10:18 PM

Really? You're that naive?

No northwind, you are naive.

You need to get away from
Scotland to have this sort of conversation (if you have then I apologise and you should look out o your window more often).

I (up until recently) worked on building sites in London, ALL of building sites in London are 70% foreign, yes lots of eastern Europeans etc it's all part of the same argument.

I'm ashamed to call myself English at times.

Scotlands building sites are Scotish through and through, I know this because I've worked on them, yes you get a few foreigners but sites are mostly Scottish.

-Ralph-

15-02-11, 10:19 PM

So just the same as all-white schools then.

Can you name an all white state school where it would be impossible to get a black kid enrolled? Assuming they lived in the right area, the school had places available, etc, etc

Owenski

15-02-11, 10:22 PM

Exactly the sort of thing people said when they started giving irresponsible silly women the vote. Britain already is multicultural, we're talking about it in this thread, just look around you. What won't work is trying to pretend we're all the same and that's where PC falls on its ****.

the first thing you've said in this thread that I've agreed with.

northwind

15-02-11, 10:23 PM

Here's a google street view of this area just for the benefit of anyone who doesn't know Brum. Go play spot the white person 'til your hearts content. ;)

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=ladypool+school&ie=UTF8&hl=en&hq=ladypool+school&hnear=&radius=15000&ll=52.446385,-1.859908&spn=0.0096,0.055747&z=15&layer=c&cbll=52.446352,-1.859927&panoid=fOm89dSvDRbRO2XoyBtfNA&cbp=11,345.92,,0,11.1

There's a whole bunch of them outside the supermarket, that must be the whitey ghetto :mrgreen:

Owenski

15-02-11, 10:23 PM

So just the same as all-white schools then.

followed by that belter... What all white schools?
There isnt a single all white school anywhere near here, ive never even heard of one. Muslim schools on the other hand quite a few, one on tv apparently the other night.

Stuuk1

15-02-11, 10:25 PM

So just the same as all-white schools then.

I'm sorry but you are an idiot, you are putting up obstacles now, reminds me of the annoying remark 'I know you are but what am i'

There are all black school that internally will block whites from attending, I've worked in an all black school in Limehouse, London.

All White school would accept a black student because if the black family were turned down, the race card would be shown without a doubt. This is a fact, if you can't see it, your are unbelievably naive.

Specialone

15-02-11, 10:27 PM

Actually I did some black history at school, mainly about slavery but also about the black men coming over in the 50's to fill labour shortfalls.

Btw, I would rather listen to a black radio station ( not Asian ) than radio one, I fecking hate it, load of sh1te.

Your missing my point about White history month, I'm commenting on the fact that black activities are branded black xxxx, yet if we put White xxxx it would be frowned upon by the pc brigade.

As it happens, like I said earlier, if my old company employed all whites there wouldn't have been half as much work done ;)

My wife has just reminded about social services when she worked for them, they had to employ 5% disabled people as well as ethnic minorities, government directive.
So it does happen,

-Ralph-

15-02-11, 10:29 PM

followed by that belter... What all white schools?
There isnt a single all white school anywhere near here!

There won't be up there :lol:

My niece and nephew were at an all white school in Southam, Warwickshire until relatively recently (2 years ago maybe).

There will still be lots of all white schools in Scotland.

Stuuk1

15-02-11, 10:37 PM

The Idle Biker

15-02-11, 10:40 PM

To me racism isn't necessarily what you think or feel, we all feel predujice, we all feel aggresive or defensive from time to time, we all feel frustrated when the things around us change for the worst, it's natural, it's in us and we'll all curse and blame others and then, the PC do gooders that have flopped too far to one side will try to make us fell guilty about how we feel. ****em.

What's racism to me are the actions: the kid in play ground with no mates cause he's the wrong colour, the bloke going home from work on the tube surrounding by blokes threatening him cause of his colour, the guy who gets his head stamped on cause of his colour, the girl with the swastika carved on her arm cause she stood up to the local BNPP, the family that gets dog **** pushed through their letter box, and the kids who get spat at, the best girl at work who gets overlooked cause of her colour. Seen all this, loads more and worse, it's all ****ing horrible when you see it up close and personal. Base reactions, racism is garbage, lowest demonator, inexcusable.

Not pretending I have the answers, I feel the same when mullahs and reactionists, and segregation tosspots strut their stuff but blow it .........if I gave in to all my natural reactions and base instincts I would have been banged up long ago. Personal view of course but you've got to try to make it work, weed out the extremists, **** stirring politicians and newspapers and people will try to get on. Going for a joint now and to listen to my Lennon albums..:smt055

Specialone

15-02-11, 10:42 PM

Just switched news on to see a Muslim school being closed because of extremist views being taught to the children, show me a white person at that school... Therefore an all black school.

Case closed.

Only temporary for now it said earlier as police decided it was in interests of safety.
Not saying all Muslims are like this but if this type of thing is the only thing non Muslims see and hear, you can see where we get our opinions from can't you ?

northwind

15-02-11, 10:42 PM

Ah you know what, this is just pointless circling as usual. What's funny is you're exactly the same as the PC brigade- twisting the world to meet some daft personal belief system. It's just as sad at either end. Obviously not very much point in trying to talk people out of either one though. Don't know why I'm still arguing with people on the internet, I'm off to the garage ;)

<edit- sorry Specialone, that wasn't at you! your post came in after I started typing!>

Specialone

15-02-11, 10:46 PM

thulfi

16-02-11, 12:32 AM

*Well, I am, but don't think I am on any stupid guilt trip because we used to own half the world like all these left wing idiots seem to be. We used to own half the world because we were the best in the world, the most ambitious, the most intelligent, the most industrious. We should think about staying there, not apologising for it.

And before you used to own half the world, the beasts from the east ruled the whole world (or what was worth owning at the time). That's simply civilisation, and whilst these parts of the world were savage, maths and science were flourishing elsewhere.

Being the most intelligent, industrious, ambitious etc is not worth squat without some basic morality and human rights. Slavery in many parts of the world was abolished long ago..Cassius Clay and many others of his colours converted and changed their name for what reason? Because the religion they sought was about equality in colour long before their nation gave a toss.

Actually, if we're using colours to describe people, then the white man was treating black people like absolute crud not too long ago. USA, and much more recently South Africa. Even when America abolished slavery, black people were still second class citizen's and treated awfully. The senseless killing in South Africa - truly horrific. Can the white man not bring 'civilisation' to a country fairly without treating the natives like animals?

One white man got very powerful in the 1930's, and his racist ideology almost led him to accomplish his goal of exterminating a whole load of people based simply on their religion. Didn't get too far off with the body count of 6million innocent men, kids and women mind you.

The lesson, white men with a lot of power will destroy much around them, starting with cultures and religions they don't understand or want to eradicate on the basis of racial scapegoats. Based simply on history and statistics.

Surely I'm not generalising here am I?:rolleyes:

BanannaMan

16-02-11, 01:46 AM

Cassius Clay converted and changed his name for what reason? Because the religion he sought was about equality in colour long before his nation was.

Not even close.
The fact is Cassius Clay coverted to avoid being drafted into the US army, so he would not have to go fight the war in Vietnam.

thulfi

16-02-11, 01:53 AM

*delete

thulfi

16-02-11, 01:55 AM

The fact is Cassius Clay coverted to avoid being drafted into the US army, so he would not have to go fight the war in Vietnam.

Really? I've read that

After winning the championship from Liston in 1964, Clay revealed that he was a member of the Nation of Islam (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nation_of_Islam) (often called the Black Muslims at the time) and the Nation gave Clay the name Cassius X, discarding his surname as a symbol of his ancestors' enslavement, as had been done by other Nation members.

Ali's religious beliefs at the time included the notion that the white man was "the devil" and that white people were not "righteous." Ali claimed that white people hated black people.[7]

also this
x7YF58ygric

Accepting the Islamic religion was better for me, whereas another person; Shintaoism, Buddhism, Christianity (Baptist, Catholic, Protestant) Jewish, that may fill another man...but you can choose any religion you want, but if you believe in your seeked God (because all of 'em are good'), so I chose the Islamic religion, that's why I chose it.

BanannaMan

16-02-11, 02:16 AM

Really? I've read that

Yep it's true.
He did have to go to jail for it but avoided the war.
What a pussy. They never send celebs to the front lines. :rolleyes:
And it was 3 years before his # came up in the draft.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_Ali

"Originally known as Cassius Clay, Ali changed his name after joining the Nation of Islam (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nation_of_Islam) in 1964, subsequently converting to Islam (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam) in 1975 and more recently to Sufism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sufism).[when? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style_(dates_and_numbers)#Chro nological_items)][2] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_Ali#cite_note-beliefnet-1) In 1967, Ali refused to be conscripted into the U.S. military, based on his religious beliefs and opposition to the Vietnam War (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_War). He was arrested and found guilty on draft evasion charges, stripped of his boxing title, and his boxing license was suspended. He was not imprisoned, but did not fight again for nearly four years while his appeal worked its way up to the U.S. Supreme Court (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Supreme_Court), where it was successful."

speedplay

16-02-11, 10:14 AM

Northwind, I'm really sorry but it does sound like you have been hiding in a little white blinkered corner somewhere all your life.

I was born in a reasonable sized town in North Devon (about 70k people).
At one time there was one asian family running the corner shop and one black guy called Nicky Adams.
Black Nick was from Trinidad and was a bloody good plasterer and everyone asked for him as "Black Nick".
I've got some great memories of Nicky as I saw a far bit of him due to him and Dad working and drinking together and was also my god father.
Racism wasnt so much of an issue and a couple more asian families moved into town.
Nobody minded, caused a fuss because they had integrated themselves into the rest of the town.
One lad I went to school with had a hard time from some of the stupid kids due to the fact he was called Rice and was a "paki", well actually he was half Syrian but still got labeled a "paki" as they didnt know better and were too thick to actually see past the skin tone and get to know the guy.
I moved away from my home town in North Devon in 2003.
When I left there the town was about 92% white still.
Moving to Northampton was an eye opener for me due to the fact that pretty much everywhere you go in town, english is the last language you hear.
Polish is very strong here as well as Romanian, Albanian and of course Indian languages.
I have never been racist and have always tried to see things from both sides even if sitting on the race fence gets you splinters in the ass so to speak.
I was lucky enough to land a contract in Kingston Upon Thames for 12 months and the build team was 6 English lads and 32 others from Romania, Lithuania, Poland etc.
We (as English) were in the minority on an English site.
I had a great time and it was new for me to be able to chat openly about what other races and cultures believe in and live.
Dont forget here that I was from a pretty sheltered town in the ar5e end of knowhere until this point.
Now having worked in Luton, this is where some of my views were changed.
I was spat at, had cars driven towards me and threatened verbally and physically, because I was white and working in an asian area.
It wasnt just me, it was anyone on the team who was white.
Gladly, I left the site for a better job elsewhere...
Coventry has a high Asian population who keep themselves to their own areas within pockets of the city.
They buy one house, move the whole family in and buy houses in the same street as they become available.
The more of the families move there, suddenly more houses come on the market.
The areas spread and more surrounding houses come on the market.
I have not felt the threat in Coventry but can see why a white family would feel intimidated by being in a mostly Asian populated area.
The schools become Asian filled, the teachers are Asian too and the white families move out to a different area.
This creates "Asian only" schools as the whole catchment area is predominantly Asian.
Having had the Joy of working in Birmingham for the last 2 years, I can also relate to what Specialone has commented on.
Again, the same as Coventry, small pockets are bought and are spreading.
I have been in areas of Birmingham where I have looked around and see no other white people.
That is FACT.
I wont even go into the mess Peterborough has got (22 different languages according to Cambs Constabulary at last count) into where there are complaints about santas grotto in the shopping centre at christmas as it is "Too white" FFS, Its in England!!
There are areas that have had so many race related problems that the police wont even go there unless they really have to.

I am lucky in my position where I choose to employ who I think is best for the job in hand.
I have worked with companies who have been informed by Investors In People that they should be taking on a more "multi cultural" workforce.
Rubbish.
My rules are that first they have to have a good level of the English language before they even set foot on my site.
Chinese, Asian, Black I really dont care but if they try and pull the race card, rightly or wrongly, I'll throw them off site straight away.
I need to be able to tell them once what to do and let them get on with it.
More importantly if something is falling off the scaffold above me, I want them to be able to shout and tell me to get the f**k out of the way...

Yes I have had my eyes opened wide by moving to the Midlands and yes, I have made some good friends from different races and beliefs, But I do see the growing problem in certain areas, especially as more come in from eastern europe while we are struggling to keep ourselves going as it is.

I dont mind people trying to better themselves in a different country and try to get a better life, but the least that should be done is to actually learn the native language (I know some areas of Brum doesnt have English as the native language:rolleyes:)

So, In sumary, I am not racist, But I am rapidly becoming less proud of being English too.
More and more so as England is being swallowed up in PC claptrap.

I wonder what would happen if we tried to build churches and convert muslim countries to christianity....

Oh yes, They would cut our heads off..:rolleyes:

Owenski

16-02-11, 10:20 AM

woooppp wooopp wooppp Speedy for PM! ;) here here old boy, very well defined post.

speedplay

16-02-11, 10:30 AM

woooppp wooopp wooppp Speedy for PM! ;) here here old boy, very well defined post.

Had to happen one day:rolleyes:

yorkie_chris

16-02-11, 11:03 AM

And before you used to own half the world, the beasts from the east ruled the whole world (or what was worth owning at the time). That's simply civilisation, and whilst these parts of the world were savage, maths and science were flourishing elsewhere.

Being the most intelligent, industrious, ambitious etc is not worth squat without some basic morality and human rights. Slavery in many parts of the world was abolished long ago.

Actually, if we're using colours to describe people, then the white man was treating black people like absolute crud not too long ago. USA, and much more recently South Africa. Even when America abolished slavery, black people were still second class citizen's and treated awfully. The senseless killing in South Africa - truly horrific. Can the white man not bring 'civilisation' to a country fairly without treating the natives like animals?

The lesson, white men with a lot of power will destroy much around them, starting with cultures and religions they don't understand or want to eradicate on the basis of racial scapegoats. Based simply on history and statistics.

Surely I'm not generalising here am I?:rolleyes:

True, but do the Greeks have some sort of guilty conscience for inventing trigonometry? A lot of kids doing GCSE's would say they should. :-P Are the Romans guilty? Are the Iranians guilty? Are the turks guilty? Nah, it is just some idiots here who have this ridiculous notion of shame.

We should be the best, with morals. If China is going to be the next great power, guaranteed they don't have any.

South Africa? What about Rhodesia, utopia of racial equality now eh :-P

You want to generalise based on history and statistics? Black men must all be knuckle dragging, genocidal, raping animals. Last I checked there have been more race wars in Africa than anywhere in Germany or Balkans.
There is no lesson there about race, just one that people will kill each other based on no sensible reason. Not long since millions of white men killed each other over a feud began 20 years before. Si vis pacem, para bellum.

Owenski

16-02-11, 11:52 AM

I dont know which is more appropriate, blinkered or cacooned. As mentioned a multiple occasions in this thread, I dont think a persons views is as much defined by a malfunctioning cerabelum as it is thier surroundings. Case and point is Speedy's post.

thulfi

16-02-11, 08:53 PM

Speedplay, I see where you're coming from in your post. After all, you've lived in Luton. I've driven through it a few times, and usually wanna drive out as fast as possible.

I wonder what would happen if we tried to build churches and convert muslim countries to christianity....

Oh yes, They would cut our heads off..:rolleyes:

I don't agree with this though. Sweeping and inaccurate. You will find many muslim countries (particularly the middle east and north africa) have very many christians residing happily within, and there are many historical churches in the region.

Christianity is not a white religion and didn't start here. Many christians ended up staying in or near the region their religion originated from.

I think it's real paranoia and islamophobia if people think that there is an underground muslim agenda to take over this country and convert everyone in it to islam. Would never happen or come close to happening.

Actually the only people who come knocking on my door are the Jehovahs.

Biker Biggles

16-02-11, 08:58 PM

He said jehovah
Stone him.

Bri w

16-02-11, 09:19 PM

He said jehovah
Stone him.

*In a high pitched squeaky voice*

speedplay

16-02-11, 09:32 PM

I wonder what would happen if we tried to build churches and convert muslim countries to christianity....

Oh yes, They would cut our heads off..:rolleyes:

I don't agree with this though..

Obviously didnt teach about the crusades in your school then...;)

dizzyblonde

16-02-11, 09:55 PM

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTDJ0AQOpDwjxA46bkVc4j0d2IIaGLa2 h-pcd5-QLgW4Xasyb50&t=1

thulfi

16-02-11, 09:56 PM

Obviously didnt teach about the crusades in your school then...;)

I don't understand what Christianities (Roman catholic europes) attempt to recapture and control the 'holy land' has anything to do with my post, or your post about people getting beheaded if they build churches in countries where the majority of people are muslims in this day and age.

Crusades were a time of outright wars. Your post implies you fear muslims want to convert this country, and mosques are allowed to be built in this country because people here are so tolerant whereas try and build a church in a muslim country and you get beheaded!

You need to open your eyes, or perhaps travel a little.

dizzyblonde

16-02-11, 10:01 PM

I don't agree with this though. Sweeping and inaccurate. You will find many muslim countries (particularly the middle east and north africa) have very many christians residing happily within, and there are many historical churches in the region.

hmm a difficult thing to debate about. See I can go to Cyprus, and rather too many Churches, especially in the Turkish Northern 'unrecognised' side, have been taken over, ransacked and turned into Mosques, all exterior emblems defaced. In fact a large monastry, in Famagusta, has been nicely turned into a museum as an after thought, to keep the Greeks happy:rolleyes:

Yes I am aware, that I am talking about a different issue, but why the lack of respect for religious churches. I haven't really ever seen a mosque being so disrespectfully changed to a Christian place of worship.

thulfi

16-02-11, 10:08 PM

I haven't really ever seen a mosque being so disrespectfully changed to a Christian place of worship.

http://www.worldbulletin.net/index.php?aType=haberArchive&ArticleID=21756

According to the report, Taşköprü Mosque, often referred to as the Thursday Marketplace Mosque, and Çukur Mosque in Plovdiv, Bulgaria, were converted into restaurants where alcoholic drinks are served, while a mosque in Constanta, Romania, was transformed into a nightclub.

also,the dome of the rock, the most important mosque in Jerusalem

During the Crusades (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusade) the Dome of the Rock was given to the Augustinians, who turned it into a church while the Al-Aqsa Mosque (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Aqsa_Mosque) became a royal stable. The Knights Templar (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knights_Templar), who believed the Dome of the Rock was the site of the Temple of Solomon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_of_Solomon), later set up their headquarters in the Al-Aqsa Mosque adjacent to the Dome for much of the 12th century. The "Templum Domini," as they called it, was featured on the official seals (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knights_Templar_Seal) of the Order's Grand Masters (such as Evrard de Barres (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evrard_de_Barres) and Regnaud de Vichier (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regnaud_de_Vichier)), and it became the architectural model for Templar churches (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Replicas_of_the_Jewish_Temple#Replicas_of_the_Temp le_in_the_form_of_the_Dome_of_the_Rock) across Europe.

speedplay

16-02-11, 10:09 PM

Your post implies you fear muslims want to convert this country, and mosques are allowed to be built in this country because people here are so tolerant whereas try and build a church in a muslim country and you get beheaded!

Nothing implied in my post at all.

thulfi

16-02-11, 10:10 PM

Nothing implied in my post at all.

I wonder what would happen if we tried to build churches and convert muslim countries to christianity....

Oh yes, They would cut our heads off..:rolleyes:

:smt104

dizzyblonde

16-02-11, 10:22 PM

also,the dome of the rock, the most important mosque in Jerusalem

forgot about that one...touche;)

Aside from those in Ottoman times etc etc

I used Cyprus as an example of modern day muslims ransacking and desecrating/defacing/converting churches. Mainly as I've seen it myself. Not that they use them for restaurants and nightclubs, they use them for their own religious purposes...fairy doos, but I think the Greeks would have preferred their churches to stay Catholic, in 1974:rolleyes:

I somehow doubt the UK is anywhere near a little arguement over who should live where, or worship what, using guns and bombs to solve it, but a lot of people feel they are being closed in on. I live in an area that is increasingly turning into a Muslim area, for some its mortifying, but to me I couldnt give a monkeys as long as the place is clean and tidy and I get a good nights sleep, with neighbours that i get on with

speedplay

16-02-11, 10:23 PM

:smt104

Sarcasm was obviously lost...

Sort of guessed the sarcastic smilie may have given it away a bit...:rolleyes:

Lozzo

16-02-11, 11:01 PM

hmm a difficult thing to debate about. See I can go to Cyprus, and rather too many Churches, especially in the Turkish Northern 'unrecognised' side, have been taken over, ransacked and turned into Mosques, all exterior emblems defaced. In fact a large monastry, in Famagusta, has been nicely turned into a museum as an after thought, to keep the Greeks happy:rolleyes:

Yes I am aware, that I am talking about a different issue, but why the lack of respect for religious churches. I haven't really ever seen a mosque being so disrespectfully changed to a Christian place of worship.

Do you think that there are a disproportionate amount of mosques in Britain for the number of muslim followers? It's certainly the case in Bradford and Leicester.

In Luton, which already has a number of mosques, there are plans to build another two, one of which is quite large and the other in the Arndale shopping centre. Now I don't have a problem with mosques where they are required because a high proportion of the muslim community will use them, but when I go shopping in town I don't want to be presented with a floor full of sandals and the noise of 200 people praying.

dizzyblonde

17-02-11, 10:18 AM

As you know Lozzo, I don't live too far away from Bradford, and in Halifax there is a large muslim community. In fact I seem to recall a really boring fact a year or two back in a yorkshire property slot on the news, that the largest amount of people leaving a town was Bradford, and the largest number of people arriving to live in a town was......Halifax :)

Anyway, back to your question. You do have to remember that, a large community of people worshipping Islam, isn't just 'one' happy faith. In that faith you have different sects, just the same as the Christian faith has Methodist, Catholic C of E etc.
So even though there may be a couple of mosques popping up, it may be because that particular sect of Islam doesn't have a proper place of worship.Within our comunities there are many churches of differing sects, so its really no different to mosques...people just tend to forget that.
And hats off to them, they pay for it out of their own pockets mainly. They really do show a massive sense of community when it comes to charity.

I did have to giggle at your sandals and shopping comment, I'm not sure many folk would agree to having a big pile of them to fall over in a shopping centre, nor would I think they'd prefer to hear the Imam calling them to prayers over the latest Cheryl Cole song :)
These days I can hear calling to prayer over the top of the Parish Church Bells on a Sunday, if I'm down at my parents, bearing in mind that the church is nearer than the Mosque, it can get irritating hearing a bloke warbling out of tune!

emcf

17-02-11, 02:02 PM

You will find many muslim countries (particularly the middle east and north africa) have very many christians residing happily within, and there are many historical churches in the region.

http://www.aina.org/news/20110127195103.htm

maybe not quite so happily in some areas though.

speedplay

17-02-11, 02:26 PM

http://www.aina.org/news/20110127195103.htm

maybe not quite so happily in some areas though.

You need to open your eyes, or perhaps travel a little.

Obviously:rolleyes:

thulfi

17-02-11, 03:17 PM

http://www.aina.org/news/20110127195103.htm

maybe not quite so happily in some areas though.

lol, assyrian times article, surprising that!
in all honesty though, in these areas (egypt but namely iraq), more muslims and mosques and muslim shrines are getting blown up by nutjob muslime extremists than the christians are.

and they're fleeing to syria and jordan, last I checked they were pretty muslim countries.
heck enough iraqis are trying to flee to syria and jordan, muslims, christians or otherwise.

thulfi

17-02-11, 03:19 PM

Obviously:rolleyes:

reading newspaper articles isn't travelling. have you actually been to any of these countries?

emcf

17-02-11, 03:39 PM

lol, assyrian times article, surprising that!

here's some more links if you don't think that one is valid - [/URL]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jan/01/egypt-bomb-kills-new-year-churchgoers (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jan/01/seven-killed-alexandria-bomb-church)

[URL]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12101748

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/23/iraq-christian-exodus-christmas?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487

speedplay

17-02-11, 03:48 PM

reading newspaper articles isn't travelling. have you actually been to any of these countries?

Actually...

yes.

Hope that helps ;)

thulfi

17-02-11, 03:54 PM

here's some more links if you don't think that one is valid -
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jan/01/egypt-bomb-kills-new-year-churchgoers

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12101748

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/23/iraq-christian-exodus-christmas?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487

like I said though, in these regions the muslims are getting it worse. Iraq is a melting pot, a war zone in turmoil for many decades. after all, the arab christians are fleeing to other arab muslim countries. simply read about how the christian palestinians and muslim palestinians are practically united against the opression both faiths face. the articles below don't even touch the surface.

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english2010/world/2011-01/20/c_13700330.htm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12440175

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/8014390.stm

no of suicide bombings in iraq since invasion
2.1 2003: 25 suicide bombings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_bombings_in_Iraq_since_2003#2003:_25_suici de_bombings)
2.2 2004: 140 suicide bombings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_bombings_in_Iraq_since_2003#2004:_140_suic ide_bombings)
2.3 2005: 478 suicide bombings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_bombings_in_Iraq_since_2003#2005:_478_suic ide_bombings)
2.4 2006: 297 suicide bombings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_bombings_in_Iraq_since_2003#2006:_297_suic ide_bombings)
2.5 2007: 442 Suicide Bombings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_bombings_in_Iraq_since_2003#2007:_442_Suic ide_Bombings)
2.6 2008: 257 Suicide Bombings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_bombings_in_Iraq_since_2003#2008:_257_Suic ide_Bombings)
2.7 2009: 76 Suicide Bombings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_bombings_in_Iraq_since_2003#2009:_76_Suici de_Bombings)
2.8 2010: 44 Suicide Bombings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_bombings_in_Iraq_since_2003#2010:_44_Suici de_Bombings)

"Suicide bombings in Iraq since 2003 have killed thousands of people, mostly Iraqi civilians, and arguably constitute a new phenomenon in the history of warfare. Suicide bombings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_bombings) have been used as a tactic in other armed struggles, but their frequency and lethality in Iraq is unprecedented". wiki

thulfi

17-02-11, 03:55 PM

Actually...

yes.

really, which ones?

speedplay

17-02-11, 04:03 PM

really, which ones?
Iran, Iraq, Just did Afghan (not with the forces I might add I'm not Dangerous Dave), Saudi and Egypt.

I also have friends in Jordan and Syria too.

You want to see the stamps on the passport too...?

Stop being a knob, its just a debate.

There is no side to prove right or wrong, its a debate about peoples views.

emcf

17-02-11, 04:16 PM

like I said though, in these regions the muslims are getting it worse.

i never denied that, neither do those articles that I posted

thulfi

17-02-11, 04:17 PM

na not being knobish, genuinely interested as to which ones you'd been to.

Fair enough, so you've been to a few countries over there, didn't come across many churches or christian people from those regions on your travels then?

Well you wouldn't in iran or afghanistan to be fair. Also, wot were you doing in afghanistan if not with the forces...really though, genuine question, keep your hair on not being knobish.

thulfi

17-02-11, 04:18 PM

i never denied that, neither do those articles that I posted

Well doesn't it slightly undermine the point of 'christians in iraq are under attack because they're christian because this church and this place got bombed' when virtually everything theyre is getting bombed, regardless of race, religion, etc?

speedplay

17-02-11, 04:22 PM

Well you wouldn't in iran or afghanistan to be fair. Also, wot were you doing in afghanistan if not with the forces...really though, genuine question, keep your hair on not being knobish.

Camp Bastion has a number of civilians out there, looking at the build project of prefabricated buildings across the region for when "we hand it over"...:rolleyes:

yeah right.:rolleyes:

But this is off topic.

On topic though, no I didnt see many churches, many signs of christianity, church fayres ect...

loads of mosques though...:rolleyes:

emcf

17-02-11, 04:34 PM

Well doesn't it slightly undermine the point of 'christians in iraq are under attack because they're christian because this church and this place got bombed' when virtually everything theyre is getting bombed, regardless of race, religion, etc?

not at all. it happens as does other cr@p. saying 'regardless of religion' is missing the point a bit - the christians are being targetted because of their religion, the muslims are killing each other because they follow slightly different versions of religion.

and anyway, my original post in this thread was in response to your overly general statement
"You will find many muslim countries (particularly the middle east and north africa) have very many christians residing happily within, and there are many historical churches in the region."

thulfi

17-02-11, 05:03 PM

and anyway, my original post in this thread was in response to your overly general statement
"You will find many muslim countries (particularly the middle east and north africa) have very many christians residing happily within, and there are many historical churches in the region."

I don't believe it is an overly general statement. I'm not saying all, but very many. Iraq is an exceptional circumstance at the moment, but prior to the downhill spiral the country faced post Saddam, very many Jews and christians resided happily within.

Look at Syria, Jordan, Lebanon (virtually 40% christian), Egypt, Morocco, Tunisia, Turkey. I know several christians from a few of these countries, and they're always Lebanese or Moroccan before they are christians.

It's easy to pick out any news article where a place of worship is vandalised or people targetted in whatever country, but that does not portray an accurate picture. after all
http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/art.php?id=23324
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/muslims-call-for-calm-after-mosque-attacks-498508.html

Christians may get attacked in Beirut, Muslims may get attacked in Beirut, but the vast majority are living happily within, and you'll find many arabs unite based on the fact that they're arabs and not christian or muslim.

The issue is that virtually most muslims in this country are of pakistani descent, and they have a very different mentality to different muslims elsewhere, and so peoples views in this country of a particular religion is really based on one countries culture mixed with that religion. Malaysia for example which is predominantly muslim is cultures apart from the muslims in pakistan - a very tolerant muslim coutry with many different religions and religious holidays for each one.

speedplay

17-02-11, 05:21 PM

The issue is that virtually most muslims in this country are of pakistani descent, and they have a very different mentality to different muslims elsewhere, and so peoples views in this country of a particular religion is really based on one countries culture mixed with that religion.

The thread title "Racism in the UK in 2011" is about racism this country.

Not how Muslims are viewed abroad.

thulfi

17-02-11, 05:27 PM

The thread title "Racism in the UK in 2011" is about racism this country.

Not how Muslims are viewed abroad.

Yeh I know, but was just in a response to the whole 'if we went over there and built churches..etc etc'

speedplay

17-02-11, 05:32 PM

Yeh I know, but was just in a response to the whole 'if we went over there and built churches..etc etc'

But its getting derailed by a country mile.

The comparison was that its ok for them to build whatever they like mosque (even in heritage areas) here, but we wouldnt be allowed to do the same abroad.

The whole discussion wasnt about "how do we see the multi cultural world" but more about problems/potential problems HERE.

thulfi

17-02-11, 05:37 PM

The comparison was that its ok for them to build whatever they like mosque (even in heritage areas) here, but we wouldnt be allowed to do the same abroad.

What are you basing that on exactly? And where abroad? You can easily use a few BNP arson attacks on mosques to prove that's not the case, just like you could probably fish out some nut jobs abroad that do the same to churches.

The average joe muslim wouldn't give a toss. A corrupt regime/movement on the other hand that uses religion as a political excuse may do, but there's a reason that there's crud loads here in the first place.

edit, another derail, your pic is darnned freaky:cyclopsani:

davepreston

17-02-11, 05:52 PM

must say im having a bit of a chuccle at this, being that i actually come from a place that has had proper religious turmoil for about 300 years, we dont care what colour you are ,just what foot you kick with

people/communities will mix and seperate, countries will change majorities and minorities, and the world will keep spinning, hetitages have changed from time began you cant stop it, once you were anglo saxon or norman or britian, now your english ,irish ,scotish or welsh, soon you may be something else

this country will change again over the next 100 years and may well become a muslim state or stauch christian country again, but the fact is we will be all dead and dust before this change is concidered the norm

Specialone

17-02-11, 06:12 PM

thulfi

17-02-11, 07:14 PM

Could 3+ million white british people go to a majority muslim country and set up their own communities, churches, shops, schools and use their own laws?

Fairly naieve cos it's not that straightforward is it?

The number of stanis and Indians in this country is the result of the British empires rule and an open door policy to people from the colonies they controlled until relatively not too long ago.

From the mid-eighteenth century until at least 1947, and longer in many areas, the British Empire (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Empire) covered a large proportion of the globe and at its peak over a third of the world's people lived under British rule. Both during this time, and following the granting of independence to most colonies after Second World War (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_World_War), the vast majority of immigrants to the UK were from either current or former colonies, most notably those in the Indian subcontinent (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_subcontinent) and the Caribbean (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caribbean).
Following the end of the Second World War, the British Nationality Act 1948 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Nationality_Act_1948) was passed to allow the 800 million[7] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_the_United_Kingdom_since_1922#cite_ note-Turner-6) subjects (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_subject) in the British Empire to live and work in the United Kingdom without needing a visa. These people filled a gap in the UK labour market (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labour_market) for unskilled jobs...

Its simples, you reap what you sow. After all, more than 75% of all the muslims in this country are from India/pakistan or Bangladesh whereas all the muslims from these countries put together make less than 30% of all muslims worldwide.

And even if lets say for arguments sake that governments in these countries are oppressive to other faiths - then you just look at your own and appreciate the greater values and tolerance and be grateful you werent in a position where you had to leave your country. After all, most are here because they want a peaceful life free from war and poverty like most humans, not to come along, take over and convert the world.

speedplay

17-02-11, 07:20 PM

After all, most are here because they want a peaceful life free from war and poverty like most humans, not to come along, take over and convert the world.

But a fair number of them are here because out government will support them too.

A lot of "refugees" who come here often travel through a number of other countries to get to here.

As far as I can recall, france, spain, italy, germany are all safe countries but they travel through them to get here.

thulfi

17-02-11, 07:26 PM

As far as I can recall, france, spain, italy, germany are all safe countries but they travel through them to get here.

True, but each of these have a large number of communities that are quite specific to their country based on their history and politics.

France have the North Africans, Germany have the turks, England have the stanis and Indians...and the Italians are all racist so noone stays there too long:rolleyes:.

Clearly the refugees who made the long haul over here were not told about the weather. I mean imagine leaving your country to end up in Bradford or Luton - like the same place but colder and damper. Too late by the time they realise.

speedplay

17-02-11, 07:30 PM

True, but each of these have a large number of communities that are quite specific to their country based on their history and politics.

France have the North Africans, Germany have the turks, England have the stanis and Indians...and the Italians are all racist so noone stays there too long:rolleyes:.

Clearly the refugees who made the long haul over here were not told about the weather. I mean imagine leaving your country to end up in Bradford or Luton - like the same place but colder and damper. Too late by the time they realise.

I think most of them already know about the crap weather, but when your given a free local authority house and handouts, I dont think they worry about it too much.

Specialone

17-02-11, 07:37 PM

The 3m people I refererred to was what the unofficial figure was since 1997 when labour opened the floodgates, this figure might not be that accurate, but I'm pretty sure it's not far away judging by the rapid expansion of these communities.
Are you naive to think every immigrant has escaped a war torn land or extreme poverty?
A lot of people who have settled in this country are economic migrants, nothing more, or as Speedplay said, they would settle in the nearest safe country to their homeland.
We tolerate a lot more than most and pay welfare unlike some countries.
Could we get welfare payments in wealthy Muslim countries?

I don't blame them tbh, I probably would in their circumstances, but I wouldn't bite the hands that feed them like some do.

You might deny it as much as you like, but my belief is they won't rest until White British is a minority in this country and under sharia law.

speedplay

17-02-11, 07:40 PM

You might deny it as much as you like, but my belief is they won't rest until White British is a minority in this country and under sharia law.

"Welcome to Boardsley Green"

:rolleyes:

Bri w

17-02-11, 07:44 PM

I must say, there are some head in the sand views knocking around.
Ask yourself this...
Could 3+ million white british people go to a majority muslim country and set up their own communities, churches, shops, schools and use their own laws?
The answer as speedplay said is no, it would not be allowed, but it has here.
Post as many fecking articles as you like the fact will still remain, its one rule for one and another for everyone else.

I'm not sure if its head in the sand or where they live in the UK they've just not seen the diversity that there is in other areas - nature 'v' nurture. Lets face it, if you've been on the receiving end of racism how you behave the next time you are a minority in that area will be different than someone who's never experienced it - self preservation.

What goes on in other countries actually isn't relevant. And how many times has someone said, "when they come here they should..." The same applies if we visit other countries. Why should we expect them to bend over backwards?

Where things appear to breakdown is the pc brigade have managed to impose positive discrimination to create a so called balanced, interactive, multicultured society at the expense of the indigenous people. And just how integrated is multicultural Britain?

Then you hear someone of Asian decent saying "I'm British, I was born here." True, you were born here and have a British passport but have you adopted the British way of life or have you adopted your parents/grandparents way of life? Our worse still are you trying to change our way of life?

For those that are basing their argument on a theoretical belief get yourselves down to areas of Brum, or Manchester, or Burnley, or Peterborough or worst of all in my experience Luton.

thulfi

17-02-11, 07:46 PM

Are you naive to think every immigrant has escaped a war torn land or extreme poverty?

Perhaps not, but I do believe virtually all are looking for a better life. I would love to go work as a doc in America when I graduate...so long as I do it legally what's wrong with that? Do you have to be escaping a war torn land or extreme poverty?

Or probably you don't realise what a big decision it is to up and leave your home country leaving all your family behind, regardless of the reason.

Could we get welfare payments in wealthy Muslim countries?

not a chance, they don't even look after their own.

You might deny it as much as you like, but my belief is they won't rest until White British is a minority in this country and under sharia law.

They won't rest from what exactly? your belief is your belief, but it must not be nice living with such paranoia. If you believe that then you must really despise the lot of 'em.

Specialone

17-02-11, 07:48 PM

"Welcome to Boardsley Green"

:rolleyes:

Or small Heath, sparkbrook, sparkhill, alum rock etc etc.

Btw it's bordesley green :rolleyes:

speedplay

17-02-11, 07:49 PM

Or small Heath, sparkbrook, sparkhill, alum rock etc etc.

Btw it's bordesley green :rolleyes:

Sorry mate, I'm a foreigner in those parts...;)

Specialone

17-02-11, 07:55 PM

Perhaps not, but I do believe virtually all are looking for a better life. I would love to go work as a doc in America when I graduate...so long as I do it legally what's wrong with that? Do you have to be escaping a war torn land or extreme poverty?

Or probably you don't realise what a big decision it is to up and leave your home country leaving all your family behind, regardless of the reason.

Nothing wrong with you working in the states mate, the difference is you won't take 3m people with you and make it little Britain.

I'm not paranoid mate, I'm a realist, when year after year the Asian communities are expanding and getting closer to where I live, then I'll be the minority or have to move from an area I was born in.
Experience it for yourself dude before calling me paranoid.

thulfi

17-02-11, 08:01 PM

I'm not sure if its head in the sand or where they live in the UK they've just not seen the diversity that there is in other areas - nature 'v' nurture.

Well Ive been living and studying in London for about 6years. That is about as multicultural as this country gets, but many areas around here race is hardly an issue. So many different colours and religions.

My uni for example is about as diverse as you get, and there is simply no hostilities/ingnorance/name calling. Each ethnic group have their own little society,with dinners/parties/charity events - nothing wrong with that at all.

Most of my life Ive lived in predominantly white areas. Because of the way I look, I have been called all sorts in the past

'pee off u effing jew, u dirty turk, smelly arab' those sorts of things*. All by white people.

It gets to a stage where you're arguin with someone and you know they are just about to pull the race card cos they're losing it. I'm not surprised when colours in numbers bite back with their own racist remarks - people who get bullied bully.

I've never had to resort to a racist remark cos in my opinion its a massive sign of weakness.

I went to school in Aylesbury, and have driven through Luton and other such places and honestly would not want to live there. Just because people come over it doesn't mean they should lose touch with their original culture or heritage though by becoming 'British' - what ever that means exactly.

I think one of the best things about America is how they have their little areas, China Town, Litte Italy, Korea Town, etc. I think it's a great thing provided people can integrate, live peacefully and not resort to racial name calling and stereotypical ideas based on some bad experiences.

*actually, thinking of my foreign looking mates, I would say each without fail has been on the receiving end of numerous racist comments by some white person thruout their life. You all might not beleive it, but you haven't faced it from the other position.

The Idle Biker

17-02-11, 08:04 PM

You know the lairy Asian youths, that cause trouble, start fights, throw abuse at white girls that turn them down (and worse). The ones that hate the police and anyone in a uniform, the ones that play football, drive ****e cars too fast and try to talk with black street cred accent, while really hating the black guys with a passion? You know the ones. Are they the ones that were born here and are trying to fit in by adopting British culture? Just a thought as I sit on the train, supping Stella in true brit fashion.

Woz

17-02-11, 08:16 PM

Then you hear someone of Asian decent saying "I'm British, I was born here." True, you were born here and have a British passport but have you adopted the British way of life or have you adopted your parents/grandparents way of life? Our worse still are you trying to change our way of life?

These are the words of a student of mine who is of Pakistani decent. On his family and acquaintances*... "Yeah, they all say they're English, that they were born here but you just wait and see which flag the b***ards are waving when the (Pakistan) cricket team gets here"

*I say acquaintances because he's happy to say he has few asian friends. Why? He wears a Help for Heroes wristband and his old friends and even his own family have abused him for it.

Back to the original topic of racism in this country... why is it wrong to use the word 'black' in a derogatory manner (blackballed, blacklisted etc) but the term 'white elephant' is perfectly acceptable?

Bri w

17-02-11, 08:31 PM

Lozzo

17-02-11, 08:34 PM

I honestly don't believe there is much in the way of true racial tension in this country, but what we appear to have developed is proper religious tension, especially regarding the rise in followers of islamic beliefs.

thulfi

17-02-11, 08:42 PM

What might I not believe? You shouldn't assume things, it does nowt but weaken your point.

Have a look at post 33 in this thread.

And I have lived abroad and experienced being on the receiving end. And if you do have a look at post 33 you will see I have a very good understanding of rascism.

Not directly aimed at you, and as you have an asian in your family you're somewhat atypical. But I do honestly believe that a fair few people don't realise the extent of abuse virtually all non white people endure at some point in their lives in this country.

Many posters on here seem to be fuelled out of resentment that their area is being overwhelmed with foreigners - in a place like that racial tension is bound to develop. It's the abuse that the only black student or asian student in a year or school of 99% white people is what I think many people underestimate. Situations like that just never made any sense to me...why hate on the coloured person, he's a real minority in this area and hasn't harmed you so why the senseless name calling?!

It's strange, I was born in Wales and have lived here my whole life, but honestly felt I blended in more and felt less racially aware when I went to the states than I do here (fair enough it was Florida and California but still). It's nuts, here if you've got black hair and anything from an olive skin tone and darker you're nowt but a paki. I've had Greek and Italian mates that have been called paki's...nuts.

dizzyblonde

17-02-11, 08:46 PM

*actually, thinking of my foreign looking mates, I would say each without fail has been on the receiving end of numerous racist comments by some white person thruout their life. You all might not beleive it, but you haven't faced it from the other position.

Peg says when he was growing up in Scotland, he used to get ignorant, uneducated comments like 'paki'...and hes a feckin Greek!

As he grew older he had no end of girlfriends though lol.

Even an Italian family used to get racist comments in Dumbarton, he says people don't wish to think it, but Scotland is a pretty racist place.

I do wonder how our son will look as he grows up, and if he might be subjected to funny comments, but hes so damn cute, I doubt he'll have any problems:cheers:

Edit...there you go postin before me....;)

thulfi

17-02-11, 08:51 PM

lol dizzyblonde, you posted that just as I edited my final paragraph. Beggers belief though doesnt it?

speedplay

17-02-11, 08:52 PM

*actually, thinking of my foreign looking mates, I would say each without fail has been on the receiving end of numerous racist comments by some white person thruout their life. You all might not beleive it, but you haven't faced it from the other position.

I refer you to an earlier post..

Now having worked in Luton, this is where some of my views were changed.
I was spat at, had cars driven towards me and threatened verbally and physically, because I was white and working in an asian area.
It wasnt just me, it was anyone on the team who was white.

Bibio

17-02-11, 08:54 PM

Scotland is a pretty racist place.

yes but no but. we just hate everyone even ourselves :smt019

speedplay

17-02-11, 08:56 PM

yes but no but. we just hate everyone even ourselves :smt019

Thats ok, cause everyone hates the scottish, its not a race thing though I think its just genetic...

dizzyblonde

17-02-11, 08:56 PM

Thing is, if Peg was called 'Greek' or 'Jock' (cause even though he is Greek, hes got a Jock accent) nobody would bat an eyelid....because we don't see it as being insulting.
Its purely because someone somewhere, has decided that 'paki' is an insult.
Anybody who is a Jock, Paddy, Taff, Scouser, Geordie, all get associated with where they come from, and those 'descriptive' nicknames are not seen as insulting.

thulfi

17-02-11, 08:58 PM

Now having worked in Luton, this is where some of my views were changed.
I was spat at, had cars driven towards me and threatened verbally and physically, because I was white and working in an asian area.
It wasnt just me, it was anyone on the team who was white.

I refer you to an earlier post..

ditto

I'm not surprised when colours in numbers bite back with their own racist remarks - people who get bullied bully.

incidentally, aylesbury is similar to Luton. I went to school there, and got abused by the same lot you're on about a fair few times...I'm neither brown nor white. Go figure eh.

speedplay

17-02-11, 08:58 PM

Its purely because someone somewhere, has decided that 'paki' is an insult.

+1.

Call a black guy a Nigger its seen an insult too, but oddly enough, not from another black guy:confused:

Bibio

17-02-11, 09:00 PM

Thats ok, cause everyone hates the scottish, its not a race thing though I think its just genetic...

wrong way round m8. its a well known fact that the only people who love the English are in fact the English.

its really funny but the Scottish are loved the world over but we hate everyone :takeabow:

Bri w

17-02-11, 09:00 PM

Not directly aimed at you, and as you have an asian in your family you're somewhat atypical. But I do honestly believe that a fair few people don't realise the extent of abuse virtually all non white people endure.

Many posters on here seem to be fuelled out of resentment that their area is being overwhelmed with foreigners - in a place like that racial tension is bound to develop. It's the abuse that the only black student or asian student in a year or school of 99% white people is what I think many people underestimate. Situations like that just never made any sense to me...why hate on the coloured person, he's a real minority in this area and hasn't harmed you so why the senseless name calling?!

I think you've actually nailed it, albeit maybe by accident. What some posters feel, as their home area is 'taken over' is what you describe in your last sentence. The loan white is the real minority in what was his 'home' and is pushed out by a combination of the racial tensions/abuse and the fact there are no fish and chip shops in his area any more.

Expand that example to whole community levels and that is where national racial tensions develop.

I have no problem with anyone of any race coming here providing the infrastructure is in place to support them, they pay their way and they don't try and impose their beliefs and laws on me. What they do in their churches, community halls and homes is up to them and none of my business.

Why should I be paying for an economic immigrant's home/clothes/dinner etc when they've come here with no home/job and expect a handout. It's totally different if its a genuine asylum seeker.